It’s hard to turn on the news without hearing about violent assaults, murders, and sexual abuse. We probably feel revulsion when we hear about these things, wondering how a person could do something so despicable. We might also fear for our loved ones’ safety, or our own.
For some individuals with obsessive-compulsive disorder (OCD), the fear can take on a very different quality. Rather than fearing that they or someone they love will be a victim, they are gripped with terror that they themselves might commit some horrific act. I call this form of OCD “Malevolence OCD” (MOCD) because the person fears doing something truly evil.
[Listen to an interview with MOCD expert Jon Hershfield, MFT]
Like any type of OCD, MOCD starts with a thought: What if I do something awful to another person? That thought is the obsession, which triggers anxiety since it would be terrible to do what the person fears. All of us want to avoid anxiety and prevent bad things from happening if possible, so the person will do something—the compulsion—to try to make sure s/he doesn’t hurt anyone. The person often feels temporary relief after a compulsion.
Let’s consider an example:
I’m standing in the kitchen chopping vegetables. My brother comes in the kitchen and asks me if I need any help. I’m about to ask him to wash the broccoli when an image suddenly comes to mind of him standing at the sink with his back to me and me holding the knife behind him. What if I stab him in the back? God forbid I think to myself as I shudder at the thought and try to put it out of my mind—Who thinks such things? I set the knife aside for a minute and say, “I’m good, but thanks for offering. Feel free to keep watching the game.” I wait until he’s out of the room before picking up the knife again.
This example has many of the common features of OCD. First, I’m triggered by a fear: What if…? I then do several things that are meant to prevent what I’m afraid of: I put down the knife, encourage my brother to stay out of the kitchen, try not to think about it, and say a short prayer. I’m also left feeling like I must be really messed up.
In MOCD, these obsessions and compulsions happen over and over, taking up an incredible amount of mental space and filling my days with fear and dread. Let’s take a closer look at this form of OCD and how it can be treated effectively (yes, it can).
When Is It OCD?
It’s important to distinguish between OCD about maliciously hurting others and a truly high risk for causing harm. A person who is actually dangerous may have a history of assault and will feel a desire to hurt others. The person may try to resist those urges because of the likely consequences, but not because the idea of acting on the thoughts or urges is incredibly unsettling.
People with MOCD usually say hurting someone else is the last thing they would want to do. Even thinking about the possibility is upsetting. To actually commit such a heinous act would be the worst thing imaginable. And yet the thoughts come back, over and over.
But How Do You Know for Sure You’re Not a Terrible Person?
I’m fully aware that trying to distinguish between these two categories, important as it is, will almost certainly feed the doubt in those who have this form of OCD. After all, how do I know I don’t want to hurt someone? And what if I don’t want to right now but then have a sudden urge that I act on without thinking? Or what if I just “lose it” and snap? What if I’ve been pretending all along to be “normal”?
In fact, the quest to be 100% certain I won’t do what I’m afraid of is a big part of what makes it OCD. When it comes right down to it, it’s hard to be completely sure of anything. This uncertainty—or rather, the effort to eliminate uncertainty—is what fuels OCD. When we aim for certainty, OCD always holds the trump card. As we’ll discuss later on, beating OCD means refusing to play its game.
Myths About Malevolence OCD
As if having MOCD weren’t enough, there are unhelpful beliefs about it that compound the difficulty. The primary myth is that having this condition means that “deep down” the person really wants to do the thing s/he is afraid of. In fact, obsessions about harm used to be called “Aggressive” obsessions in the mental health community based on an old-fashioned understanding of the condition.
In a related way, the general public often misunderstands MOCD, too. Most of the time when someone says she’s afraid of hurting people, we take these concerns seriously, especially in the current environment where we’re told, “See Something, Say Something.” If we don’t probe a little deeper we’ll miss the crucial point that the person doesn’t want or plan to act on the fears.
I would trust an individual with MOCD to stand behind me on a train platform as a train arrives, to hold a knife near me, or to be around my kids. In reality, a person with MOCD is probably the last person who would hurt anyone.
Which raises the question, if I don’t want to do these things, why do I think about them all the time?
Why Do I Have These Thoughts?
Often in MOCD a person will ask, “But if I don’t want to do it, why am I thinking about it so often? What kind of person does that?” As we’ll see is, the answer is: someone who doesn’t want to do anything wrong.
Our brains are great at imagining things that haven’t happened. They do it in dreams as well as in our waking life. If we walk by a knife with its handle jutting off the edge of the counter, our minds automatically imagine a person walking by and knocking it off, possibly hurting someone. By imagining an accident, we can prevent it: We move the knife away from the edge. So our minds feed us images of bad outcomes to help us avoid them. It’s something our minds are good at and that helps us in countless ways.
It’s important to point out that thoughts like “What if I just decided to stab this person?” are not at all unique to MOCD. I have them, others I talk to have them, and in fact the vast majority of people (whether or not they have OCD) will have these kinds of thoughts. The difference in OCD isn’t having thoughts of hurting others but the reaction to these thoughts.
If I have a sudden thought of, “What if I pushed this person in front of the oncoming Amtrak train?” I might think it’s a weird thought and then my mind will move on to something else. I won’t take it seriously.
In contrast, a person with OCD is likely to be horrified by the thought and to worry there’s something dreadfully wrong with him—and that he poses a serious threat to others. If he doesn’t want to be a bad person and doesn’t want to act on the thoughts, then he’ll probably try to make sure he never has a violent thought.
It’s exactly that effort to avoid having violent thoughts that causes them to multiply. As you probably know, it’s virtually impossible to keep something out of our minds without thinking about it—otherwise how will we know if we thought it? So whereas before a person with OCD might have gotten the thoughts a few times a week, by trying not to have them she will start thinking them many times a day, or multiple times an hour, or maybe even constantly.
What’s worse, constantly thinking about these fears can make them seem less upsetting simply from the repetition. Then a person with MOCD might be horrified that he’s not as horrified by the thoughts as he used to be, and may mistakenly believe that he’s warming up to the idea of acting on them.
Common Fears in Malevolence OCD
Obsessions about hurting others can take different forms. Stabbing someone with a knife is a common one, probably because knives are so readily available and the idea is so grisly. Others include:
- Beating someone with a baseball bat
- Stabbing someone with a pencil, skewer, scissors, or other sharp object
- Sexually assaulting someone
- Shoving someone off the sidewalk into oncoming traffic
- Pushing someone in front of a train
- Pushing someone down the stairs
- Perhaps the most upsetting, being a child molester
Again, the individual with OCD does not want to do these terrible things and is not at a greater risk than the average person for doing them. Nevertheless they might worry that they’ll change in some fundamental way, becoming a cold, callous, sadistic human being, even a “monster.”
It’s important to mention that another form of Harm-related OCD can also be directed toward oneself: What if I commit suicide? What if I impulsively jump from a bridge? I don’t focus on this topic here because it’s nuanced enough that it deserves being addressed separately.
Common Compulsions in Malevolence OCD
The compulsions (or “rituals”) in MOCD are intended to prevent what the person is afraid of. They’ll generally involve trying to prevent the thoughts, trying to prevent the feared actions, and trying to make sure I’m not a bad person.
One of the most common compulsions is reassurance, either from oneself or others. The person might tell herself, “You would never do that. You’re not a violent person,” or, “Thoughts are just thoughts, thoughts are just thoughts.” Or they might ask their spouse whenever they have a compulsion, “You don’t think I would actually do anything like that, do you?” or, “Having that thought doesn’t make me a bad person, right?”
Sometimes a person with MOCD might seek out a professional with expertise in OCD—not only for treatment but as a form of “checking with an authority.” Unfortunately the relief a person generally feels from reassurance doesn’t tend to last long, sometimes not even until the end of the session. Reassurance leads to needing more reassurance.
Others might ask God for forgiveness, perhaps with a set ritualized prayer: “God, I’m sorry to have these thoughts. Please know that I don’t mean them and would never act on them. Please take away these thoughts forever.”
It’s also common to check repeatedly for evidence that the person wouldn’t hurt anyone. For instance, when seeing a story about a gruesome murder, they might read everything they can about the perpetrator to see if they’re similar in any way. These checks can backfire, of course, because they might read about a “seemingly normal childhood” or “no previous history of violence” and realize with horror that they shared a similar background.
Avoidance is also a very common response to Harm obsessions: avoiding the news in case there’s a triggering story, movies and TV shows with violence, knives and other sharp objects, the grocery store and other places with lots of people, and anything else that leads to the obsessions. And while the avoidance might provide some temporary relief, it plays the same role as compulsions in keeping the person in the clutches of OCD.
Consequences of Malevolence OCD
The real harm, of course, happens to the individual who has Malevolence OCD, and the fallout can be devastating. An aunt might avoid being around her nieces and nephews for years out of fear that she’s a child molester—and may avoid having kids of her own for the same reason. A man might never go out with friends because he’s afraid of assaulting one of them. Students might not go to class where they worry they’ll attack the professor.
And of course the emotional toll can be severe. Imagine if you lived every day worried—maybe even convinced—that you were terribly dangerous or depraved. It’s common for OCD to lead to depression as a result of these self-condemning beliefs as well as the withdrawal from enjoyable activities and relationships. Tragically in some cases the person may even resort to suicide.
Treating Malevolence OCD
Thankfully there is highly effective treatment for MOCD in the form of exposure and response prevention, or ERP, a type of cognitive behavioral therapy. I’ve covered the basics of ERP elsewhere (see this post on my Psychology Today blog); here I’ll discuss some of the specific applications for Malevolence OCD.
In a nutshell, ERP is about doing the opposite of what OCD wants. The exposure part will involve doing the things that bring up obsessions. They might include:
- Holding a knife with someone else nearby
- Standing behind people on a train platform
- Being around kids
- Watching the news
- Looking up stories about violent assaults
The therapist will work with the person to come up with a list of exposures for the person to start confronting. They’ll start with the easier ones and gradually work up to the more difficult ones. With practice a person will become more comfortable being around these triggers.
Crucially, the exposure will have to be coupled with prevention of the compulsions—exposure without ritual prevention won’t be helpful. So a person will need to stop seeking reassurance, saying ritualized prayers, checking to see if they might be capable of violence, and so forth. Over time it will get easier to do normal activities without compulsions.
With the right treatment, the obsessive voice will tend to quiet down; stepping out of the fight against the thoughts takes away their power. People also generally feel more confident that they won’t act on their thoughts.
However, the point of ERP is not to know for sure that the obsessive thoughts aren’t a concern, or even to get rid of them. Perhaps the most important part of the treatment is becoming more comfortable living with some degree of uncertainty. After all, we can’t be 100% certain that any given person won’t act violently, myself included. And we can learn to better tolerate that uncertainty.
As you might imagine, the work can be challenging—and at the same time worth the effort as it leads to freedom from OCD.
Where to Find Help
I’ve had many requests for more information about how to find help for Malevolence OCD. The International OCD Foundation is an excellent starting place; check out their website.
There are also several excellent books on OCD and effective treatment. Here are some that I recommend; check your library or click on the link to purchase them from Amazon. (Please note: A percentage of sales through these affiliate links is used to support this website, at no additional charge to you.)
Overcoming Harm OCD focuses specifically on the Malevolence OCD subtype of Harm OCD, with “mindfulness and CBT tools for coping with unwanted violent thoughts.” It’s written by OCD expert Jon Hershfield, MFT, who wrote two other books I recommend (see below). 
Overcoming Unwanted Intrusive Thoughts, focuses on upsetting obsessive thoughts like those discussed here, as well as other forms of intrusive thought OCD.
The Mindfulness Workbook for OCD focuses on developing a different relationship with obsessive thoughts, so they’re given less attention and importance.
The OCD Workbook presents the fundaments of understanding OCD and how to treat it effectively, and has a chapter dedicated to breaking free from horrific thoughts.
When a Family Member Has OCD is my go-to recommendation for an OCD sufferer’s loved ones. It’s written by Jon Hershfield, an expert in treating OCD and working with families, who happens to have OCD himself. You’ll find a compassionate and authoritative guide in this book.
Freedom From Obsessive-Compulsive Disorder is a classic on treating OCD effectively. It includes a chapter on mental obsessions, and specifically addresses harm-related OCD (including MOCD).
I co-wrote Overcoming OCD with Janet Singer, whose son overcame severely debilitating OCD with exposure and response prevention therapy. Janet tells the story of her son’s recovery, and I provide information on many topics related to OCD. While we don’t focus on Malevolence OCD, we present general information about the condition, its effects on family members, and the best ways to treat it.
This calmed me down.
For some moments 🙂
Thanks for your comments, O. That makes sense, doesn’t it? That it would provide temporary relief, but that it would fade over time…. Thankfully with some focused work it’s possible to get a more lasting sense of calm.
I’ve been diagnosed with OCD for a long while and have had other issues come into my life that lead to a lot of fear and confusion. I was diagnosed because of my obsessive handwashing, fingerpicking, scalp picking and other things. But after going to a therapist for a snapping issue I’ve been having, where if I feel cornered or threatened I would physically attack people, and I most likely would only remember bits of the attack or not at all.
My therapist told me that my OCD wasn’t helping and giving me harm thoughts, like harming myself or others in almost all the ways mentioned here. I finally looked into it and this is definitely something I’ve been suffering before I developed the snapping issue. I just thought I must’ve started giving into my problematic thoughts. I’ve been emotional and frustrated over this for a long time, so I’m thankful to know just a bit more about why I’ve been like this. I hope I can soon figure out what’s been causing me to snap, so I can finally work on getting better.
Thank you for your comment, MH. I’m sorry to hear about the struggles you’ve been having. It’s important to say that harm-related OCD does not involve acting on the intrusive/obsessive thoughts. I hope you are getting helpful treatment for both the OCD you’ve been diagnosed with and the snapping issue that you described.
Thank you for your response! I’m well aware that they aren’t the same thing but I do believe that the OCD probably made my issue worse. Sadly I haven’t been able to find proper help and support yet, as my therapist has sent me to another place that I’m currently waiting on. But I have found that better managing symptoms of other unrelated disorders and my OCD, aids in lessening the severity of the snapping when nothing else was helping, but not outright stopping it. My last snap ended with me getting a concussion sadly, but at least it wasn’t as violent as previous ones. Hopefully I can figure it all out soon.
You’re very welcome, MH, and it makes sense that OCD would make things worse. I do hope you can figure it out and find relief as soon as possible.
Thanks for this article, I have found it very useful.
I developed harm OCD later in life (in my late 50s) – in part I believe in response to several major bereavements, which also brought to the surface some hidden childhood trauma.
I purposefully make excuses to use knives when my partner is in the room (even though there can be an image in my head of me stabbing my partner in the back, or myself in the eye). I find humour useful – and sometimes tell my partner about the images in my head, but less so now. I can now go weeks without intrusive thoughts getting to a point where they bother me… And then WHAM – it is as if they have regrouped and double their efforts to make life as miserable as possible for me. Usually, these relapses are caused by external stressors – e.g. something I have to do and which carries considerable responsibility. Or just a silly argument with a stranger. Things I have found useful – therapy (which has now stopped), exercise (I swim four times a week), humour and saying to myself ‘this too shall pass…’. It does get better… but it can be a case of two steps forward, one step back… but the movement is always forwards, in the main.
Thanks so much for sharing your thoughts and your wisdom, JP. Those are all great ways to deal with harm-related OCD. And it’s helpful to know what can trigger a spike in symptoms. All best wishes to you for many more steps forward!
Thank you so very much, I thought I was alone on this battle; there is a song called: “Forgiveness by MusicForBLOOD” and it may be about this exact topic and those battling with the same intrusive behavior; between your context the bible and that song there is some sort of recompensing going on internally that says I can do this! You rock, Seth!
I’m so glad to hear you found it helpful, Don, and that you’re finding strength in those sources you described. I’m sending you all best wishes as your journey continues.
This did help me in a way as I watched a disturbing movie the other night I was already having bad anxiety before than I was completely fine during the movie than afterwards even tho I found it disturbing I kept thinking what if I did that to my family or friends or even to myself and it scared me to where for the last 2 days I could barely function considered going to the hospital I’m gonna try the exercises this article named I already tried one I felt a sudden urge and thought what is this gonna do and put it away that made me feel I was taking away the power of the thoughts cause I’m the type of person that gets upset if I accidentally step on an ant I am seeking out a therapist which I should get one soon and hopefully from there I’ll be ok
Read the article. Makes sence to me, had trouble with the line How do I know I’m not a bad person. I didn’t fall in your OCD Category. I’m 100% disabled with Complex PTSD and chronic anger issues. I struggle with anger that never goes away. I think out in detail just how I will harm someone. I’ve been confined once and fear that. Have not acted out since, but is there a healthy outlet for me. I feel like a time bomb, but remain in isolatation as much as possible to avoid life. Anger drives my PTSD.
Thanks for sharing this, Richard. It does sound like a different thing you’re experiencing. I would say the healthiest outlet would be to find effective treatment for the PTSD and anger. Here are some thoughts about the process in case it’s helpful: How Do You Find a Good Therapist? Sending best wishes to you.
I have had these violent feeling at times that children and pets , and relatives triggered sometimes unfortunately resulting with attacks, though my study and Christian faith has , somewhat helped, me and others
I appreciate your sharing your experience, Karen. These sound like something different from what I described as harm-related OCD, since it sounds like they led to actual attacks. I’m glad you’ve found some help.
I recently finished my bachelors degree for social work. I’m only 19 years old and want to help children and families. However the past few weeks I got an obsession with watching crime and murder tik toks and came across people who got randomly vicous attacks on people like demon possessed. From that day on I started fearing everyday that that would one day happen to me and. I feared it so much and now it’s stuck in my head all day. I have so much anxiety and it is so random. It is like i fear that and tell myself I would nerve ever hurt a soul then it pops up in my head all over. It’s like the more I fear it the more these weird thoughts come up of oh no what if I went to the kitchen and grabbed a knife and hurt myself or others. Knowing i would never actually do this but fearing it makes it worse. 🙁 What do I do? I have never had OCD but i suffered childhood trauma and have anxiety b
Thank you for sharing your experience. I would suggest seeking treatment with a therapist who specializes in OCD. You can find one near you through iocdf.org. Or you could check with a local university if you’re near one. There are also good books (linked in the post) to get started with. I hope you find relief soon.
I’m having these attacks rn and I’m starting to calm down. Thank you!
wow, just wow. Thanks! really helped 😀 Have a good day!
My pleasure, Alexander! Thanks for taking the time to comment.
Thanks so much my love hase tryed so hard to controll her thoughts. Many times I have handed her harmful items when she goes off and she holds them unable to use them. And she trust me more naturally d has sro0ed for the most part obsessing over thought of harmong me when she gets triggered. Holy shit I came up qith this myself and it’s working. Thus helped her feel so much better about herself and now she feels sage to seek help for this as sujested and I’ll help every step of the way.
Thank you, Amber. That’s very interesting that your intuition seemed to steer you in the right direction here. Seeking help is an excellent idea. You might also get Jon Hershfield’s excellent book on Harm OCD. Sending you best wishes.
I have thoughts aswell but they almsot feel like urges to do so. It’s awful and it makes me feel like I’m not myself anymore.
Thanks for your comment, Matt, and sorry to hear you’re going through that. I recommend consulting with an expert who can help you identify what’s going on and the best way to deal with it. Sending you all my best wishes.
My dad watches these shows all the time where they figure out the murderer. I keep thinking how horrible it would be to do something like that and it’s become a low-key obsession to stop thinking those thought which cause me to think of then more. I don’t have time for a therapist or the ride or money. I want to know how I can work towards
having peace of mind with my thoughts
I appreciate the comments, Elizabeth. I recommend Jon Hershfield’s excellent book on Harm OCD. It offers excellent guidance. Here’s the link Best wishes to you.
Thanks alot Sir for this I. been mess up days thinking I might be the most horrible person on earth I went into my kicketen and hide all the knife. I was really afraid to go out. My problem started when I witnessed a violent crime movies about drugs lord I couldn’t get it out of my head. For days soon I started having anxiety where I couldn’t breath thinking I was cable of killing someone. Later I try to fix this by saying if I do that I might have to kill myself because I can’t live with my conscious the more I avoided the thought the stronger it became soon. I couldn’t leave my room I started crying why God am I thinking these things can you remove this thought from my head. Later I started panicking if I will survive this year I couldn’t eat for days worrying about my violent thought and why they haven’t fade away. I went at the hospital I am from Africa. There isn’t a single Doc here who really understood why was happening to me. I jumped on the internet in search of solution and luckily I found this blog. My stomach was grinding and my anxiety level usually goes to the roof I think this was pushing me into depression. But I am overcoming it I went out today talk with few friends. And place a knife near me to see if I will actually act on the thought but nothing happened. I think read your blog help I need to read a book on this.
I’m sorry for your struggle, George. You described MOCD perfectly when you said, “the more I avoided the thought the stronger it became.” I hope you can find the help you need. Jon Hershfield’s book (linked on the blog post page) is an excellent resource. I’m sending all best wishes to you.
Hi,
I now know i am suffering from this form of OCD ( mainly based around my daughter)
Its been so distressing and have formed great anxiety over it also.
I now fear this can cause a mental illness as to where i will hear voices who will make me do these horrible things 🙁
Can this happen?
Thankyou
Hi, Bee. I appreciate your comments. I can’t comment on your specific situation but I can tell you that the fear that some form of mental illness (for example, schizophrenia) will cause a person to do horrible things is a very common fear in harm-related OCD. Sending you best wishes for finding the help you need.
Just read your article Seth , have been suffering with awful thoughts of harming others for 30 years , in a trough of severe anxiety at present , reading that I am not alone fighting this nightmare gives me hope I can recover will order your book thankyou Dan
I’m glad to hear it, Dan, but sorry to know you’ve suffered. Jon Hershfield’s book is really excellent for Harm OCD. Sending you all best wishes.
Thank you so much for this. This just came out of nowhere lately after a very stressful period. I’ve been avoiding loved ones out of fear. It’s terrible but you gave me a lot of comfort
Thanks for your comments, Tee. It is terrible, isn’t it? And sad how it can make a person isolate from the ones they love the most. There is plenty of reason to hope, and good treatment that’s available. I wish you all the best.
Thank you so much it calmed me down a lot and I’m not thinking about these thought at the moment I cried if refleif that it’s gone for now I’m saying a prayer every night I’m actually 13 and scared to death.❤️
I appreciate your comment and am glad you got some relief. I encourage you to talk to an adult you trust so you can find lasting relief and any necessary treatment. This doesn’t have to interfere with your life or make you miserable!
Thank you so much for this article, i read it and I did feel much relief. But every time i feel relief, my fear evolves and attacks me somewhere else. Sometimes i fear not fearing and sometimes i feel convinced that i am a bad person and i really dont know what to do .
Thank you for your comments, Ian. It’s true that our fears can be a moving target, and we can worry that we’re doing something wrong if we’re not worrying. We often need to seek effective treatment in order to find lasting relief, rather than riding the roller coaster of our anxiety and fear. I recommend iocdf.org as a good starting point for a person who might be dealing with OCD.
Thanks so much for this. I have OCD, no rituals but pure O. After years of theraphy and lots of effort I could understand, little by little, that the fears I had were not at all that uncommon. I used to think I was such an alien…
Nowadays I take minimal medication and have beaten those awful fears.
I encourage anyone that is reading this to never give up. Work hard and you will succeed. Hugs to everyone.
My pleasure, Federico. I’m so glad to hear that you’re doing better. Thank you for your comments and for the encouragement you offered to everyone.
Thank you for this. I always thought I was the only person who did this and I would feel depressed for hours and hours after reading about a murder or watching a scary movie of some sort. Constantly scared that I could do such a thing. Also considering I’m only 17 I’m constantly stressing I’m going to snap or something in my coming years and becoming an awful person.
You’re very welcome, Em. It’s sad and true that so many people feel alone with this issue. Sometimes it seems that adolescence can be a particularly difficult time for this since one’s identity is still forming and OCD can create intense worry about becoming a terrible person. I wish you all the best.
This is excellent. I had this. Paxil daily and on occasion, Xanax were a life saver for me. I’ll definitely share this! Thank you!
Thanks for sharing your experience, Lindsay. I’m glad to hear it sounds like you’re doing better. There’s reason for hope!
I had this in the the 80’s and there wasn’t much info about it then. I was in my twenties and would read books on end trying to find reassurance that I wasn’t bad and wouldn’t do something horrible. I did find one book that gave me some temporary relief (I still have it) but the added depression from living with the OCD took its toll and I ended up staying at a psych hospital for 2 weeks. I then felt really crazy. I did get the help I needed, mostly medication and therapy, although no ERP and I worked my way through it. A very difficult time. So glad this is out in the open nowadays, I felt so isolated during my experience. Good luck to all, do not suffer in silence! Thank you Seth~
Thanks so much for sharing your experience, Janice. It’s good to know there’s more awareness now than in the ’80s, though from the responses to this post there’s still a long way to go. You described a sadly not-uncommon scenario in which this condition leads to one’s own private hell. I’ve seen how tragic it is when a person bases their life around this fear, especially when treatment is available. That’s what motivates me to spread the word. I’m so glad this post is reaching people, and hope others will continue to share it or other resources so we can shine a light and offer hope to those who need it. I really appreciate your willingness to comment.
I Googled this topic and found your website. I have had this condition, as you describe it, since I was about 18 years of age, but it has gradually increased in severity (I am now 36). Indeed, I read an article that compulsive neurological conditions actually change the brain, reinforcing the respective pathways (much the way any behavior is learned) and thereby more readily triggering the unwanted reaction. I also noticed an increase in this OCD behavior ever since I became a parent, which makes sense, as this opens both a more stressful and more responsibility-prone (less error-tolerant) chapter in our lives.
I appreciate your description of treatment possibilities, as I had hitherto been a bit confused about what “exposure therapy” meant in this context, where obviously you do not want to act directly on your fears; now I understand what is meant, which is an exposure to the situations that trigger the fear, and indeed sensing that one does not act on them. The fascinating part is knowing that these fears are not rational, but they are obviously a product of parts of our brain that we do not directly control, much the way you describe in the beginning of your essay.
Thank you for your comments, eggman18. You’re exactly right about the changes on the brain from OCD compulsions, and thankfully the right therapy leads to positive brain changes. And good points about what the exposure is——not to the feared outcome, but to the trigger of the fear. Parenting is a common fear related to this concern, for the reasons you described. All the best to you!
Thank you for your article Dr Gilligan and the informed and sensitive way you describe this condition.
I’ve struggled with Harm OCD for 2 years now, mainly focused on my daughter. It is such a traumatizing condition. Everything I took for granted about myself has had a terrible battering. I do not know whether to trust myself as a person. This is not a problem I faced before the OCD struck.
I’m having trouble getting access to ERP where I live, and my income is limited due to mental health problems. Is it possible in your opinion to use a workbook to undertake ERP? Or would that not be advisable?
Thank you.
My pleasure, Scott. I appreciated your feedback. It’s truly a traumatizing condition, isn’t it? And no more so than when it involves one’s own family members. And yes, access to ERP is a real problem in most parts of the country. It’s a big part of why I’ve written the books I have, to bring effective treatment to people who couldn’t otherwise get it. Many people are able to get a lot out of a good self-directed OCD workbook (like this one). If self-guided treatment isn’t enough, then more intensive options can be considered. I don’t encourage self-directed treatment when the OCD is particularly severe or if there are serious thoughts of suicide. I wish you the best in your recovery. Also you might check out Janet Singer’s blog if you haven’t already: https://ocdtalk.wordpress.com/ Seth
Thank you for your kind and thoughtful reply Dr Gillihan.
I am in Australia where the ERP situation is – if anything – even worse. I’m receiving ACT, which does seem to be helping to some extent.
I wasn’t able to make the link work for the workbook you recommended. Is it possible to provide its title?
Thank you.
Sorry the link didn’t work! The book is The Mindfulness Workbook for OCD: A Guide to Overcoming Obsessions and Compulsions Using Mindfulness and Cognitive Behavioral Therapy by Jon Hershfield and Tom Corboy. And I’m sorry to hear things are even worse down under….
Fantastic article, this is exactly what I needed right now. I had recently come to understand what I needed to do to beat this vicious circle but your article really solidified it for me. From now on I will let myself feel every thought about being scared of hurting someone and I wont try to tell myself it is ok. Ill just be indifferent and not put the knife down when im in the kitchen or look away from who im talking to. The whole idea that I could hurt the people I love is so terrifying to me that ive perpetuated it and turned it into an obsession. Ive had incredible panic attacks about being scared to lose control. Thanks, I will start using your advice right away.
Thanks so much for your warm comments, Matt. I’m glad to hear that the article confirmed what you already sensed for yourself to be true. I usually find in delivering ERP that the person isn’t really surprised by the principles. They know that rituals are OCD’s false hope for relieving anxiety, and that avoidance doesn’t work in the long run. I wish you all the best along the way.
I been dealing with this for so long I just don’t know what else I can do
I feel like I need to move away from my family I’m on Prozac to help but the thoughts and fear never leaves
I can’t be at home or at work a lot of times I feel like I must be locked in a mental institution sorry for my bad English
Jose, I’m sorry to hear you’re struggling. Good ERP can help so much. I suggest starting with iocdf.org to look for resources. I hope you find relief soon.
Hi, I hope you could help. I have this scenario everyday about thinking I want to kill. No, not just thinking but hearing some noise in my head shouting to kill somebody. Then an image will pop then I’ll loses my consciousness then suddenly I’ll just realize that I was holding a knife and was ready to kill him but then my hand start shaking, my tears will burst up then I will laugh like crazy then my heart will pound loudly and fast. My breathing will be difficult then my body will feel numb. I dont know what is this. I hope you could help.
Knife, to be honest the experiences you describe do not sound like what people with Harm-related OCD experience. I would strongly encourage someone with these symptoms to schedule a consultation with a doctor or mental health professional as soon as possible, and to visit an emergency room if necessary. Best wishes to you.
Seth – Wow.
Thank you for such an informative article. My son recently approached me with a similar fear. Having come across this article ( By looking for things on OCD) has been an eye opener. He is young – only 15. Do you think he can manage to curb this before he is an adult? or at least learn to manage it a bit. He is a middle child as well which I suppose aggravates anything like this. I am actively trying to invest time and effort into him to make sure he doesn’t feel a certain way. Unfortunately he is just simply getting worked up as it is decreasing his moral and outlook on himself.
Thank you for your comments and sharing about your son’s experience, Trevor. Yes, I do think a person can curb this issue as an adolescent. I would recommend consulting with a professional (iocdf.org is a good place to start) to make sure you’re on the right track. It’s easy as parents to end up giving reassurance that just feeds the OCD, leading to temporary relief that actually continues the cycle. I wish you and your family all the best.
I have been living with OCD for years, last year was the hardest for me. Everything caused a chain reaction, being home, not being home, being around family, not being around family. Even eating caused a ritual to rise, I have been looking for an article to explain my version of OCD. When I tend to start having intrusive thoughts I like to research possibilities and when I came across this article it’s like I knew I wasent alone. So thank you, you made me feel like I can live with uncertainty.
Ghitza, thank you so much for your comments. I’m glad to hear you feel like you can live with uncertainty, especially because sometimes articles like mine can function as reassurance. That is, they can provide temporary relief and then the OCD-fueled doubt creeps back in: Is it really OCD? Am I tricking myself? Did I understand what they were describing? etc., and then more online research to get reassurance. All the best to you!
I posted but i dont it went through 🙁
I dont if i have ocd. But i keep on getting these awful thoughts. Making me feel like im a pyscho or something. I feel so lost. And i keep on checking my feelings and thoughts. How do i know if im actually not a bad person. What if im actually sicko that wants to hurt people. I get them around my family and my doggies. And i cant hug my doggies anymore cause these thoughts make me scared. I feel so lost, i cant remember who i am.
Thank you for your comment, elle. What you describe is consistent with this form of OCD. It is a good idea to consult with a professional who can make a determination. You don’t have to suffer with this. Consider starting with iocdf.org.
This website helped me a bit. Hopefully I won’t worry as much for a couple of minutes, maybe hours.
I’m an almost 13yr old, and have experienced these thoughts for almost 5 months now, and a couple of years back when I was 11 I experienced hocd (homosexual) related thoughts. I also experience thoughts were I fear I want to act on the thoughts, which is completely against my character. On bad days I relapse into my compulsions, and look up warning signs of killers and the such. This always backfires as I find out small similarities between myself and bad people such as having a fascination with fire, and hurting small animals (I once hurt my pet rat because I was extremely stressed, to the point of depression, a misfortune I am extremely ashamed off.) I have talked to my parents about my situation, but recently I have stopped because I have realised they are getting increasing annoyed to the point we’re they tell me I’m making up the thoughts on purpose, ect. As for the theory we’re genes are involved, my dad has experienced depression so crippling, he was bed bound, but I believe this was before I was born. He has also experienced these thoughts in a similar way to me but he was on a strong medication to deal with other complications.
These thoughts bother me so much, I feel I am constantly on the verge of depression.
Is my situation normal?
Thx, sajj
Just like Elle I posted but I don’t know if it went through. Just in case,
I am a thirteen yr old experiencing these thoughts. I also experience thoughts were I fear i want to do the stuff I’m thinking. I have a family history of depression (my dad had depression so crippling he was bed bound but I think that was before I was born.) and on days I feel so depressed because of these thoughts. They strike mostly when I’m alone, when my mind isn’t occupied by the chaos that is my highschool life. XD school is a good distraction, but every now and then I remember the thoughts and get a sad little…pang I guess? In my chest and I kinda go silent and stress for a while before I’m distracted again. If I’ve had a particularly bad day (days were I couldn’t, or almost couldn’t get the thoughts out of my head) I go home and research traits of a future killer, so I can tell myself I’m nothing like them. Usually this backfires, as as you stated I do this, “It’s also common to check repeatedly for evidence that the person wouldn’t hurt anyone. For instance, when seeing a story about a gruesome murder, they might read everything they can about the perpetrator to see if they’re similar in any way. These checks can backfire, of course, because they might read about a “seemingly normal childhood” or “no previous history of violence” and realize with horror that they shared a similar background.” Or I find out other similarities between murderers and myself, such as a fascination with fire, or hurting small animals ( to clarify, I have only ever hurt one animal (that I can remember, obviously) and it didn’t die because of my actions. It was at a stressful time in my life, although I can’t remember why, and I was on the verge of depression. I feel very ashamed of my actions and I haven’t hurt another animal since.) these finding make my thoughts worse. They convince me I’m a horrible person and one day I’ll just… snap. In the past I have had what I believed to be hocd(Homosexual Obsessive Compulsive Disorder) like thoughts. These lasted for anywhere from 5-6 months to a year. It was a couple of years ago now so I can’t really remember. The thoughts I am currently having have been occurring for almost 5 months now. They started after I read a magazine on Australian murders. (I definitely shouldn’t have because my parents told me not to and it’s ruined my life.) I finished reading one of the stories, and wondered; “what if i was a murderer.” The thoughts have plagued me ever since. I do have anywhere from a couple of days to week occasionally where the thoughts leave me alone, but then they are triggered again by stuff in my environment; e.g Tv, peers, ect.
I have told my parents about the thoughts, I only planned to tell them once, so they knew what was happening, but occasionally I break down and confess. Initially, they were very supportive, similar to when I was having the hocd thoughts, although recently they seem a little… annoyed. They sometimes tell me I’m making it up on purpose, or that I’m “full of it”. Not that they aren’t supportive and amazing parents, or that they don’t understand (my dad had these thoughts before I was born, when he was on some strong medication for other complications.) they just don’t…. I don’t know, “get it”
I just wanted to know your opinion, because although my parents are incredible, they can’t offer a professional opinion, and I really need one of those right now 🙂 is all this normal?
Thx, sajj
Also sometimes my mind tells me “oh you’ll like to do that” when I’m thinking about bad stuff and stuff like that but I don’t want to like it, I don’t think I do but my mind keeps telling that, Im always doubting myself because of it
Hey I’m sorry if I seem rude but I keep posting and it’s not showing up and no ones replying
Hi, Sajj. Thank you for sharing your experiences, and sorry you didn’t know if the comments were going through (they were but they have to be approved before they’re visible).
The things you describe sound very consistent with OCD—the doubting, the questioning, the wondering even though there’s scant evidence that the person would actually act on the thoughts.
As you know from my post, it’s a very treatable condition, though it does require finding a professional who gets it if you’re going to work with someone on it. For those who aren’t able to do that, I’ve added some resources to this page. I wish you all the best, Sajj. Help is available.
Thank you so much for replying Seth, I was so scared.
Every time I think I’ve gotten over it, or at least a particular fear, I’ll somehow think up another one. It’s really annoying. XD .
Thank you! ,
Sajj
This is a great article. I am currently at the midpoint of an overseas holiday with thoughts and compulsion out of control, and now worried the rest of the week and journey and all of those triggers. This is entirely how I feel and reading some one else express how awful this can feel makes me feel a bit more human. It’s hard though…
Thank you for sharing your experience, GooseR. I’m glad you liked the article. 🙂 I’m glad to know if makes you feel a bit more human, but sorry you’re suffering like this, and while you’re traveling on holiday. I hope you find some relief soon, and long-term relief when possible.
I had this problem for a while now. My biggest triggers were living with my girlfriend and driving with traffic in the opposite lane (fear of self-harm). I’m so glad that I took the time to do some researches tonight and came through your article. Now that I have a better understanding of the situation, I can finally work on myself. Thank you!
Thanks for your comment, Peter. I’m glad the article was helpful and I wish you the best as you address these things.
Brilliant, simply brilliant. I’ve just been to see a phycologist and mentioned 80% of things things mention on this article and he didn’t seem to have a clue as to what I was on about.
Thank you for this.
So glad you found the article helpful, HK. Sadly this manifestation of OCD is still not recognized and understood a lot of the time, even within the mental health community.
Dear. Dr. Gillihan:
I was close to going “off” after I had some harm thoughts, to the point where I was seriously contemplating ending a meaningful relationship (over a barking dog of all things). This article hit all the nails on all their heads, and made me rethink everything. Thank you. Thank you for taking the time to make content that makes us feel better and healthier. I think this type of work really makes a difference!
All the best!
Michel, I appreciate your letting me know. I’m so glad you found it useful, and I like what you said about this type of work making a difference. I certainly hope so. All the best to you, as well.
I’ve recently been struggling with thoughts like this and it has drained me because I’m terrified that I even had thoughts like this about my family, but after doing a little research about this I feel comforted by the fact that I’m not the only one. I’ve had passing thoughts before but it’s been constant the past few weeks like I’ll find myself thinking about it when I’m not doing anything and the fact that I have these thoughts scare me. I’ve reached out for help with a therapist recently, should I mention this to them?
Thanks for your comments, Aly. No, you’re certainly not alone. I would mention these things to your therapist, including this article if you think it might be helpful. Best wishes to you as you navigate through this.
I have suffered since I was 17 I’m now 23 I have seen so many different practitioners and am currently working with someone at the moment to help me I’ve started to believe these thoughts even though I wouldn’t do it and never have because they’ve because so intense and I have had different ocd harm thought more than one which I find distressing because when I first got this is was the one thought for years now I have loads of them and they’ve got worse and worse I feel emotionally numb like I can’t feel love some times it’s hard to cry even when I want to but then sometimes I can’t stop myself crying please can you help recommend what I should do
Thank you for sharing your experience. I’m sorry you’ve suffered with this. The best approach is to find someone who specializes in this condition, and follow the treatment (which is Exposure and Response Prevention). You might also find support through high-quality online forums like https://ocdtalk.wordpress.com/. I also listed some books at the end of the post that many people find helpful as they’re going through therapy. I wish you all the best and that you find relief. You’re not alone.
I’m so happy I found this, I was getting these thoughts awhile ago and when I got them it would make me sick to my stomach and I would actually throw up because hurting someone is the last thing I would want to do. I wanted to isolate myself because I didn’t wanna think that way, but maybe it’s best to go against the thought and show that I’m in control. Thanks again.
Maya, I was so pleased to read your comment. Your reaction to the thoughts you were having is so telling–clearly it’s the last thing you wanted to do, and yet the mind can convince us that we’re dangerous. Please don’t hesitate to consult with a professional if you need assistance working through this.
Sadly I didn’t find any comfort. I’m still terrified. I see a therapist and psychiatrist and I feel like if I tell them that I fear hurting others or that I think of gruesome scenarios that they will think it’s a step backwards. I’ve been seeing them for a year. My depression was really bad it’s better now I think but my anxiety seems worse. I really don’t know if I have OCD …I don’t know how to feel. I’m terrified to know if I can actually bring my thoughts to life. I was sexually harassed as a child and now I feel as if I would do that. I can’t stop these thoughts. What do I do?
Tay, I’m sorry you’re not finding any comfort. I hope you’re getting treatment from people who truly understand this condition, and can help you determine what you’re dealing with and the best way through it. The right provider needs to know what you’re experiencing in order to guide you through it. If you’re looking for someone who specializes in OCD, consider searching through http://www.iocdf.org. All the best to you.
hallo dr.gillihan
( sorry my english is not that much )
i have been suffering from ocd since 3 years i lived one year it was amazing without having any kind of fears ( i reach to the point that i could really automatically ignore my ocd with out feel bad about it )
and before 1 month i had some pannicattacks i went to the doctor he give is me untidepression drug and one of the side affects of the medicament was having suicides thoughts i was getting anxiou i stopped the medicament and the ocd come back becouse i was a fried from the antidepression so it’s trigger again my ocd
I’m so depressid right now but i never tried this kind of therpy i will ask my doctor about it and try to speak to my parent’s about understand it to help me get of my fears ( my fears its about harming my self my family ) it’s new challenge
thank you so much
Thank you for sharing about your experience, lora. I’m glad you’re going to speak with your doctor about getting this kind of treatment. Exposure and Response Prevention (ERP) is a first-line treatment for OCD, and for many people is just as effective as medication. It’s encouraging to know that you did reach a point where you could automatically ignore the obsessive thoughts, which suggests to me that you can return to that state. All the best for your recovery.
Hi Doctor I find your posts very relaxing. I might be mistaken as I have read about 1000 articles. This one is one of my favorites but I thought I read one of yours elsewhere that I can not can find anymore. It said something about if you had a horrible thought of killing your family you know chances are you will just come home for dinner and even if it was some deep dark secret urge frankly you don’t care. I thought wow this is normal I wish I could be that. I have had OCD my hole life. Started with contamination I would wash my hands until they bleed. The last couple years it’s been harm. Started with my EX now that she is no longer the most important in my life it switched to my mom. I am classic meaning i’m afraid of knives I threw all the knives in my apartment out. I went to the doctor who put me on Zoloft for awhile about a year and a half I was OCD free. However the side effects caused issues in my relationship via sexual side effects. I recently went off my meds thinking hey I got this beat I don’t need them after a couple months OCD came roaring back. I reached back out to my DOC who was on vacation. I have an appointment this week and was able to have the on call doctor call me in some low dose Zoloft. However reaching out to my doctors office and telling them about my intrusive thoughts he stated I need to go to the emergency for evaluation. I knew what he meant as in a trip to the psych ward. I had never been and deep down knew I was no a threat however wanted to take the doctors advice. This was an awful experience as they made me empty my pockets took my shoes and my belt. Here I am with my mother now locked in a waiting room with others on suicide and homicide watch. People with real disorders 1 man keep walking the same circle over and over. Others having fits I brought my mom and now am in tears asking her please don’t let them put me in a padded room. I found the experience to worsen my thoughts and give credit to them. When it was my turn to be interviewed by the Psychologist they quickly realized I was no threat and released me with in the hour. They did point me in the direction of some therapists who are familiar with Harm OCD. Some many people like me can not find the help we need. The fear I had when they put me in a room locked the door and started asking me the hard questions. I know my doctor was trying to help and I wanted to except that help but he obviously does not know about harm OCD. I am 33 and have been miss diagnosed my hole life. It seems that their is so much out there how do doctors and therapists still not know or are unfamiliar? The extreme trauma of being in the one place i’m so afraid to go will live with me forever. Even though I have had many harm thoughts on myself and of course others this is the 1st time I truly wished I was dead. The thought of being in that room with the t.v. with a cage over it and on the same channel is scaring. I am sorry if this triggers anyone but I had to share. My battle now goes on alone as I never want to mention an intrusive thought again. I will stick to my meds but everyone reading please please reach out to someone like this. Do not just pick anyone pick someone who is an expert. I wish all of you the best and those who are struggling keep up the fight….We can win!!!
Anthony, I appreciate your sharing about these very personal experiences. You’re so right, there is sadly a lot of misunderstanding of OCD, maybe especially harm OCD, which can lead to very unfortunate experiences for those who are dealing with it. I do hope you find the help you need to find relief. Thanks again for your comments.
Thank you for this whole article! My 13 year old daughter has been suffering with this as well as myself since she was born. I work in mental health, which has been very helpful, but this article really sums it up. My daughter just found it and said it was very helpful, and shared with me. It is hard to find OCD specialists in our area, unfortunately. Are there training opportunities for professionals to increase supports for those suffering from this?
Thank you for your comments, Christina. I’m glad you and your daughter found the post helpful. It is indeed hard to find OCD specialists, especially outside of major cities and outside the US. There are centers that offer training opportunities for professionals, including the CTSA where I was trained: https://www.med.upenn.edu/ctsa/.
It was comforting reading your post. I have always had OCD since I was young. I use to obsess over washing my hands and germs. Now I am a mother and am having these horrible thoughts that I may harm my kids. It scares me and puts me into panic mode. I am to the point where I don’t even want to be around my kids alone because I am afraid. I love them so much and I would never want to hurt them. I’ve never been this scared. This is ruining my life. It’s making me feel numb to where I don’t even feel love anymore. I wish I could go back to a month ago before this started. I am only 27 with a great job and wonderful husband. I just want to enjoy life again. It’s taking a toll on my marriage as well. I will try to take comfort in the fact that there are other people out there who are going through the same thing. I pray we all beat this.
Lana, I really appreciate your sharing your experience and struggles. I hear what you’re saying about just wanting to go back to the way things were before it all started. I will pray you beat it, too, and in addition to that I certainly hope you find the help that can provide tremendous relief. I suggest starting with a search at iocdf.org for an ERP therapist. I wish you the very best.
I am 14 years old and have suffered from some intrusive thoughts when I was 12 till now. They are truly disgusting and the guilt of having these thoughts can be overwhelming , I know. But it gets better. Imagine it as a roller coaster, it always comes down when it’s been up. Hold on all of you. The pain will ease I promise. You are all more than decent individuals and are the best kind in the world. Sensitive, conscious and self aware. I love you all… Stay strong
Casper x
Casper, you seem to have wisdom and empathy beyond your years. Thanks for your comments and your encouragement to others. I hope you’ve found the help you need for this condition. All the best to you.
It’s 12:36 am an I just woke up with a thought of hurting my wife. I’ve been having continuous thoughts of harm to whoever is around me or near me, including myself. I mustered up the courage just now and did a search online and found this article. Although I don’t think I suffer from ocd I do notice I have certain “ticks” or movements I ritually do throughout the day. Looks like I have some form
Of ocd. These thoughts of harming people started out of nowhere and have begun taking over my days. After reading your page I’m so relieved to know that I’m not so psychotic serial killer. The thought of harming people scares the heck out of me
And then I harp on the thought of why I’m
Thinking like that for a long time. Everything you explain is exactly what I’m dealing with. I can’t thank you enough for writing About this and giving people like me some Clarity on the issues. I’m so embarrassed and afraid to tell anyone about my thoughts because I figured they’d just run from me.
Chris, I really appreciate your sharing your experience, and am gratified to know you found the article helpful. It’s tragic that people with this form of OCD thinks they’re monstrous. Nothing could be further from the truth. But you’re exactly right that the condition is not well understood by most people. Please do seek treatment if possible; help is available.
Hi I have been struggling with this for about 6 months now, mainly thoughts about my son which terrify me because I love him more than anything in this world. I am feeling some relief because I’ve been doing ERP for the last 3 months. I tried meds a couple months ago but had horrible side effects and have been scared since to try new ones. My question is: is it possible to make a recovery without meds? And is is normal that I’m still getting the thoughts after 3 months of ERP? It has helped somewhat, but I guess I’m just getting impatient cause I just want to go back to enjoying my life with my little boy I’ve never had these kind of thoughts before that’s why I was so scared at first because I didn’t know what they meant about me? I am very sensitive person so from what I’ve read is that it attack what you love most and that is my son, so I guess it makes sense why it had disturb me so much… just want to go back to normal already… thank you.
Great Qs, TS. Yes, some people do recover from OCD without medication, if they get the right treatment (ERP). It’s not unusual to still have some thoughts well into the treatment; some people continue to experience at least some degree of obsessive thoughts even after successful treatment. We can’t know for sure if and when the obsessions will stop, but we can absolutely make things worse by engaging in compulsions, even subtle ones. I would certainly want to address with a person whether there might be sneaky ways the OCD is keeping itself around, such as subtle forms of avoidance. I’m confident that with ongoing work you can enjoy your life much more fully. That is my hope for you.
Hi Seth, I took your advice and met with a psychiatrist. After speaking with her she diagnosed me with ocd! I have to tell you seriously that your page really saved me from checking myself into a hospital. I honestly thought I was crazy and losing my mind with these violent thoughts. I downloaded a book you recommended “Overcoming unwanted inteusive thoughts” and started reading it immediately. The book has done wonders for me already because it really explains how these thoughts work and why they morph into deeper thoughts when we fight them. My psychiatrist loved your website and the book I mentioned. I can’t not thank you enough! I sincerely thank you for your website and reading recommendations to understand the issues. I feel like I have a new lease on life now that I am
Diagnosed and getting help.
Chris, I was so heartened by your message. That is a great report! I’m so glad to hear you’re finding the help you need. All the best to you.
Thank you sooo much this was a big help I’m 13 but I sometimes do get thoughts of what if I didn’t care if they died or got hurt of course I would but still?
Dear Seth,
Thank you for your article and all of the responses you have written, they really make a difference when you are feeling low. I have struggled with Pure O for the most part of my life. Two times it was unbearable and seeked thearpy first when I was 13, then again 2 years ago at the age of 27. I have come to terms with the fact that intrusive thoughts are going to be a part of my life even though they to do not disturb me as much since I have been taking a very light SSRI medication and had ERP thearpy 2 years ago.
I just felt helpless for the past week since my harm ocd has reared its head back into my life. Although I know deep down that these are just intrusive thoughts but I feel so disheartened that after two years it seems to have an affect on me still.
I just felt really frustrated and saw your article and just felt like sharing..
Hopefully I will be able to overcome this yet again..
Thank you for sharing about your experience, Ginger. I hear what you’re saying about feeling frustrated that the thoughts keep coming, and keep bothering you. I’m hopeful that you’ll be able to get to a better place, especially because you were able to before. It’s true that some people do continue to have obsessive thoughts even after successful therapy, but they can become much less bothersome (like “living next to a noisy neighbor,” we sometimes say). I also wanted to share this post about “Pure O” in case some of the ideas are helpful to you: https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/think-act-be/201601/mental-rituals-in-obsessive-compulsive-disorder All the best to you.
I enjoyed your article it seems to have helped a lot of people and it is always reassuring to know you are not alone, but I have acted on these thoughts. Sometimes I don’t even realized what I have done until it’s happened. It’s never been anything major to warrant real action I guess. And a lot of the time I just brush the thoughts off, but every now and again I’ll act on it without thinking. As if it’s a normal thought. Is there an exercise or can you point me in the direction of an article that deals with acting on intrusive thoughts?
Thank you for your comments, Ember. I’m not able to give specific guidance for your situation but it’s always very important to do a thorough assessment to understand one’s experience before thinking about treatment. If a person were actually doing the things that many people are afraid of, like hurting others, that would be something different from OCD. If the fear is “what if I’ve acted on these thoughts,” that sounds more like OCD. I always recommend talking with a trusted and experience professional.
Reading your post was comforting for some minutes then i read knife’s comment and i read youd answered him that he was not like people with harm OCD. Suddenly this thought came to my mind that maybe I’m like this maybe this isn’t OCD and this idea terrified me but ive never acted violently. I’m 22 and i live in Asia it isn’t easy here to find a expert who use ERP.ive had many intrusive thoughts before but these days I’m afraid of hurting people accidentally specially little kids i think what if i open my eyes and see I’ve done something horrible by accident like this: I shouldn’t hold little kids because there’s possibility of falling or I shouldn’t go near stairs while I’m holding a baby.i don’t have access to a good therapist but i don’t want to live with guilt i want my life back .it’s been a year and I’m fighting all the time but what if it’s not ocd??
Sarah, thank you for sharing about your experience. I’m sorry it’s hard to find an OCD and ERP expert where you live. It’s an unfortunate reality in so many parts of the world. What you described is a very common fear in OCD, and perhaps especially in harm-related OCD: “What if this isn’t OCD??” That’s why the treatment emphasizes living with uncertainty, because there’s no way to know with absolute certainty that this is or isn’t OCD. But when all signs suggest it is, we treat it like OCD and over time people find they can better tolerate not knowing for certain. In the process they actually come to feel more confident that what they’re experiencing is OCD. I hope you find the help you need.
i have this awful thoughts about 2 years from now, but not continuous manner, in the last year those awful thoughts to hurt my family keept for just 2 month or so.
i’ve always believe that every person can be healthy if he have enough of belief that he can beat any disease, but the problem with OCD is another story of challenge ,because you’re in challenge against yourself, that why this situation is very difficult. so if I want to beat this disease, I need a trick, is to use my mind but not directly. it’s like using my mind in parallel or you can say it in the background or in depth. it’s important that my fears don’t know that i’m thinking how i can heal or seek of solution to my OCD. its very complex solution! so how i can do that!
first i need to rewind my memories, and try to figure out how this start? cause everything in this life has a start and reason, so in my case, i know for certain how it start, and i’m certain that is the same as you, just think about!, my first thought begin with fear is like Anxiety(OGD). fear if someone harm someone you love, and you feel so nervous in same time you imagine like you beat this person(monster), this a whole scenario cross your mind in short time left you overwhelmed by an inexplicable fear, so over time this fear become more intense or more bloody and your interaction(Imagination) become more intense. this is the beginning of OCD. so now i know how its start and in same time i know what is my fears and who feed it, so if stop fearing of my OCD that will result the end of my suffering. NO NO because is too late my fears become mine, what i mean, when i was that fear of someone can heart my family, now that person it’s become me, so i combat against me! its very very important to know that and analysis like i did, the main reason why is to NOT try to escape from your awful thoughts. now i know 3 keys (The start of OCD, who feed my OCD, NOT escape). so how i can beat it for ever? no believe me this not the right question! why because if you ask this question you’re so far to beat OCD, its like you believe on it , believe that you’re a week and ask for help, no you’re not awake you’re strong and you can extinguished the fire that eat you from inside.. be strong, for me and hopefully i’ve overcome this OCD just like i mentioned and without any drugs and you can do that just believe in yourself
I appreciate your comments, Json, and am glad you found a way through your OCD. Understanding can be very helpful, as is not resisting the thoughts and not making more of them than they deserve. Be well!
Thanks Seth, for writing this post. I kept trying to search online what could I possibly be suffering from, but I couldn’t find it.
I’ve been feeling suicidal these days because I thought I was possibly a psycho in the making and I would have extreme fears of me posing as a possible threat to the safety of others.
Thank God I came across your site. You have no idea the huge sense of relief and happiness that this post had brought to me. It meant so much to me to know that I’m not a psycho in the making nor am I ever going to pose a threat to others.
I’m no longer feeling suicidal anymore and I’ve been feeling great joy that I haven’t been able to experience for quite a while now.
Thank you so much!
Nelyn, I so appreciate your taking the time to comment on this post. I couldn’t be happier to know that the post provided you with a sense of relief at such a troubling time. I certainly encourage you to seek whatever help you may need through this process, including through therapy if necessary (iocdf.org is a good place to search for a therapist). All the best to you through all of this.
doctor it makes so difficult to me,i am so guilty.whie i was sleeping my mom said in a loud voice to give food to my dog,when i heard that loud voice from my mom suddenly an anger struck my head an i got that urge to tell abusive word due to anger i controlled it totally ,i said ok to my mom a.After that i tried to control not to use bad word ,but still trying to control i couldnt,again the same thing is coming in my head ,that how could she speak in a loud voice,again i am getting irritated and i am trying to control but by trying to stop that,again my anger getting worse and its making me remember the loud voice…and my anger got extreme and got loosing control in my head,the anger started to hit my mind and started abusive words hitting my mind with bad sexual abusive words,after that i found guilty and shame like what my mother didto me, she just said to give the food to my dog in a loud voice thats it she didnt shout at me or she didnt do nothing ,for that y i did i got that much hatred and anger towards my mom,and after that i prayed to god in my mind like i have did sin i am a monster and i did wantedly etc And again the anger came out now towards god,now again i started to control that nothing bad or abusive word hit my mind,i was controlling and at the same time anger towards god builded up ,and again it came ,this time with sexual abusive words against god , it makes me so guilty ,i am getting extreme anger for unwanted reason and while trying to contro the thought it makes difficult and it turning towards god,if i get these thoughts i pray to god to help me,if the next time if the thought hit me again means ,i will get angry and i will be feeling like god didnt help me beacuase i am a monster and i am a bad guy and th anger will turn against god ,i will try to control the same and again it repeats .i am fed up, my life is going like this in a bad phase.if my father,mother or my girlfriend,they speak to me in a loud voice or if they speak to me in normal i get an urge and anger in my mind and abusive words hit my head and very bad sexual abusive thought will come to my head against my mother and girlfriend due to anger,doctor i couldnt control this ,i want to live a happy life for silly reasons y i am getting this much hatred,vengeance etc what they did to me,i am feeling guilty ,after these thought hit my mind i will recheck when i got anger what are the abusive words that came to my mind due to anger,i used to reassure and i feel guilty and i will tell to god i didnt do it wantedly,the whole day i will think y i did like this and i reassure.there are so many issues lik these.if a baby cry i will get irritated and wanted to kill ,like these kind of thought hit my mind i am totally worried and disturbed doctor,plz help me doctor,i want to live a peacefull life
Thanks for sharing your experience, kiransujay, and I’m sorry to hear of your struggles. Please do consult with a mental health professional so you can get the right diagnosis and treatment to find the relief you’re seeking. It’s hard to know from your experience exactly what it is you’re dealing with. I wish you the best.
Doctor in my small age I had this washing habit repetition,but now it stopped but while writing I avoid some letters and while texting too ,if I write those letters some bad will happen to my loved ones like this kind of thoughts occur ,and as issue in the earlier msg like anger,due to that bad abusive words hit my mind after that i find guilty myself,bad sexual thought about god ,about my girlfriend ,mother etc
Kiransujay, what you described about the washing repetition and avoiding letters while writing and texting sounds consistent with OCD, especially the idea that a person might be responsible for harm coming to others based on the thoughts the person has. Again, it’s crucial for a mental health professional to make a diagnosis for each individual. Please consider seeking an evaluation. Thank you again for sharing about your experience.
I get urges to hurt people that I perceive to be weak, (people with injuries, babies etc). I imagine just punching people in the face that I am talking to, pushing people in front of trains, off cliffs etc. I watched a movie called natural born killers and it actual made curious as to how I would feel if I actually killed someone. Obviously I have never acted on these urges however I can’t help but feel that maybe that is what separates me from murders/serial killers, I don’t act on the urges and they do…… I haven’t sought any kind of help as I have developed methods to deal with the urges and I heaven’t murdered anyone yet, haha.
Thanks for sharing your experience, John. It can be hard for people sometimes to distinguish between an urge and the actual desire and intent to harm someone. Your remarks get at an important point——that many people imagine harming someone (often the weak/vulnerable), and yet the vast majority of people don’t act on these images. What seems to distinguish people with OCD is that they’re more distressed by these images than are most people. It’s always good to speak with someone who understands OCD well in order to make a determination of whether it’s OCD, so if it is, the treatment can proceed accordingly. Thanks again.
I’ve been going through actual hell on earth for 6 weeks.it has been the worst time of my life. I was thinking I was going to do terrible things. Basically everything you said. The more I tryed to escape the deeper I got in and when the feelings of terror over my thoughts dimmed I started to think am I starting to warm to the idea as you said. I feel great now thanks to your article. Simply because I know now it exists. It’s not just me. I hav been fighting harm ocd on and off for years but it never got this bad. I also never knew it was harm ocd. Thanks Very much. I know I may or may not still need help. I’ll see how I go because I could go long periods free of it but this is the first time I have identified it and understood what’s happening. At the very very least you have given me hope. Thanks. Very much.
Robert, I couldn’t be happier to hear that you found comfort in this post. I’m also glad to know you recognize treatment may be necessary for full relief. Thank you for sharing about your experience.
I’m glad I stumbled onto this page. As a Marine Corps veteran, I’ve been struggling with these kinds of thoughts processes with almost no knowledge of the terms for too long, in my opinion. Thank you for doing this for people. I really hope you can help and guide people as you did for me. I think I’ll be able to better handle myself but I do have one question: Is it possible to be in some kind of gray area between Harm OCD and truly dangerous to others? I only ask because I feel there are many people who do fall into that category, like myself, due to more uncommon factors amongst the populace such as military training, MMA training, etc. Thank you for your time, sir.
Thanks so much for your comments, Shane. I’m glad the post was helpful, and that it helped one of our Marine Corps Veterans. Unfortunately there are so many people who don’t know what they’re dealing with. I’m starting to work on ways to bring the most effective treatment to people who otherwise couldn’t get it, and plan to have something available in the new year.
As far as the gray area you asked about, it’s all gray area to some extent. Everyone has the potential to be dangerous to others, with some a more potent threat due to training, weapons, etc. OCD wants complete certainty, so the treatment emphasizes living with the uncertainty we can’t avoid. That said, the chances of a person being the opposite of what they want to be is vanishingly small.
Hi, my name is kacee, 25 years old. I have a 4 year old boy and husband. Past 8 months I’ve been having terrible anxiety.. I was prescribed lexapro for the anxiety I was constantly thinking about how bad it was everyday.. I finally started to take lexapro. Week 2 into it I kinda obsessed over a article about the man killing his family and was so sad about it. My son since the day he was born I over obsessed over his every move he’s never spent the night away from me. The minute I leave him somehere I would constantly text my husband or mom if he’s okay. Anyways back to the case something snapped that day inside me like could I be crazy could I hurt my family. Then I started feeling omg I’m going crazy I could hurt my family. Witch I’m the total opposite person. I stopped lexapro thinking maybe it was that. 2 months off I’ve been a emotional roller coaster. I felt I could harm my family. When I never in my life ever ever could, they our my world, for some reason it was mainly my son and I love him the most. I would question myself watching him now. I would notice I didn’t want him on me as much. I was wondering if I could hurt him. Like I’m pushing him away… it’s killing me. I just wanna be the mom I just was. I always wanted my son on me I always loved him laying with me. It’s like I have these urges that I know could never be real * I would die for my son. So why do I feel like I’m protecting him from myself 🙁 I don’t want him sleeping with me anymore I wonder if I wake up in my sleep and could hurt him. Why is this happing. I got prescribe some medication from my physiatrist I think I’m getting a little better still on a low dose of it and about to be 2 weeks on it soon! I still feel I’m protecting him from me. Still notice im not being myself all the way around. Still weird urges or thoughts or whatever you call this could I hurt him. I’m just a mess and feel so alone 🙁
Kacee, thank you for sharing your experience. So many people can related to what you’re describing. It’s so hard when these fears get in the way of sharing the love we have, isn’t it? I do hope you’re able to get the help you need. I’m working on ways to make helpful information more readily available so people don’t have to keep suffering. I wish you all the best.
What if a sufferer of Harm OCD believes that they already HAVE committed a heinous act? My husband has struggled for years with hygiene OCD, with his only relief being drinking to excess. Over the past year, he has started experiencing blackouts and begins to believe that during this periods of memory lapse, that he has molested a child, or severly hurt a person, even though he knows he would never do such a thing. This is since a few months ago, he blacked out and assaulted someone to defend me, yet he doesn’t remember doing it, and is convinced he is capable of doing it again. But often he believes he has done something, and spends hours scouring local news to find articles where an assailant was not identified, and matches his description. Is there a way to console him when he reaches these conclusions? I will add that we are expecting our first child in a week or so, and he believes he will be carted off by the police at any minute, and that he will never get to meet his son
It’s a great question, Robyn. It can be especially difficult when the doubting is about the past, not about what could happen in the future. How do we make absolutely certain something hasn’t happened—especially when we have blackout episodes? I don’t imagine the Kavanaugh hearings were helpful in that regard. And throw in the assault you mentioned and it’s even more difficult. True relief will only come through stopping the compulsive need to be certain (like asking for reassurance, checking the news, etc.). Those compulsions might help a little in the short run but are what keeps OCD alive. As I’ve mentioned on here, I’m working on ways to make information about Harm OCD more available to those who need it, because clearly the need is there. Thank you for your comments.
Thank you so much for this article. I thought I’m the only one having these kind of bad thoughts. I’ve struggling for long time having this kind of thought until now. I’ve searched a lot on the internet and read a lot about my problem but failed to find the right explanation about it. Your article really explained well my situation, your article is so informative! Hope to read more of your articles! God bless.
Thank you for sharing your thoughts, Shalimar. You certainly are not alone. I’m glad this explanation was helpful to you. I’m working on a way to make this information more widely available so others, including the general public, has a better understanding. All the best to you.
What if it’s not just knives and other thing I would rather not mention? (which I have many thoughts of and is one of the main reasons I am here in the first place) What if it ties into the fear of being oneself. To pretend your someone else because you believe that part of you is dangerous. So you try to change it. I’ve tried and I’ve tried and I’ve nearly destroyed every part of me except for the obsession to help others. What do you do than? You can’t hold a knife than and slowly become better. I don’t know who I am and I constantly think of the perfect things to say till they lose their cincerity. I can’t change anymore, I don’t know what I am. What do I do now?
I appreciate the questions, Trent. It’s a great question, and you’re definitely not the only person who has had a fear of being oneself because it “could be dangerous.” Treatment for OCD would involve, as always, doing the opposite of what OCD is demanding, like doing things that clearly involve being oneself. It would probably also involve more spontaneity, to push back against the urge to “say the perfect thing” etc. This work is best done with a therapist, after a thorough assessment. I wish you the best as you deal with things.
Hello, my name is Collin. I have been suffering from OCD for multiple years now, and have especially struggled with violent intrusive thoughts. I have learned that by writing them down, I am able to see how irrational they are, and they usually end up dissipating. Recently, my roommate came across my journal entries, and found many about severely harming her. She confronted me and told me that she was afraid that I would snap and do something to harm her; that she had been locking her bedroom door at night, out of fear that I would come and hurt her while she was sleeping. I have been able to not let these thoughts bother me up until this point, but now am beginning to fear them again because someone I am close to is now afraid of what I might do to them. I’ve been trying to figure out the best way to move forward- and just have one question to sum up everything I’ve said. What do I do if the person whom is being targeted in my violent intrusive thoughts, becomes afraid of me and thinks that I am going to hurt them?
Thanks for your questions and for sharing your experience, Collin. I’m glad you found a way to deal with the upsetting thoughts. It’s so hard to help others to understand them, though, isn’t it? I don’t know for sure how a specific person could be helped to better understand, but I think this blog post could be useful for many people as a beginning. I’ve also begun working on a book about this form of OCD—for those who have it, for the people who love them and want to understand, and for general public knowledge. All the best to you, and to your roommate.
Is there any natural treatment, is it exercising? Diet? I’m only 14 and very scared that I might hurt someone, I really really don’t want to I know it’s just a thought, I just want to know natural treatment, I don’t want to contact any medical professionals
Thanks for your comments, Mason. Diet and exercise can be helpful, but if treatment is required that usually means seeing a psychologist or other therapist, or taking medication. Young people should talk with their parents or another trusted adult about what they’re experiencing. It’s important to get the help a person needs. I’ll be wishing you all the best.
So I’ve just recently started having these thoughts about hurting my niece. I haven’t really been around babies that much ,my niece comes to my house almost every weekend. I’ve never thought of harming her until now . Every time I think of harming her I have a panic attack. And it’s not like it’s a once in a while thing it happens constantly. I go to therapy but like I read it doesn’t really help. I’m planning on telling her about this article so I can get the correct treatment. I feel horrible for thinking these things because I would never hurt her ever. I’m still in school and I tend to have these panic attacks in school. I try to distract myself but it never works . I’m afraid that this feeling will never go away and I will suffer from it for the rest of my life and it will never stop
Thank you for sharing your experience, Bubbels. I’m sorry to hear you’re going through that. It’s a good idea to let a therapist know about the right treatment if they’re not aware of it. Why continue to suffer if you don’t have to? You can also find a directory of OCD specialists on the International OCD Foundation website, http://www.iocdf.org. And I actually started a new Facebook group in the past week as a place to connect and find information and support: https://www.facebook.com/groups/MalevolenceOCD/. This condition doesn’t have to shrink your life. I wish you the best.
It weighs a ton on me and I seriously think I will never be the same again and it’s never going to stop. I really need help before I grow into adulthood and constantly have to avoid kids because I’m afraid of hurting them .
This helped me out a lot and brought me so much peace. I thought I was a horrible person, even though I have no means of committing the things I think. I’m 17 and I don’t know how to get help. At least this helped me out a little.
Bea, I’m really glad to hear the article was helpful and brought you peace. It’s hard when you don’t know how to get help. I hope there’s someone you trust, like a family member or family doctor or friend, who would understand and can help you out. I’ll also mention that I recently started a closed Facebook group for MOCD that you might consider joining–https://www.facebook.com/groups/MalevolenceOCD/. It’s a place to share information and find support. I wish you all the best.
I looked up malevolent ocd and only 2 articles showed up. I was so pleased reading this but I’m scared too and the reassurance only stays for so long…I want to feel closer to God and now I feel like God will not accept me due to these intrusive violent thoughts. What is most terrible is the person harmed in my thoughts is the person I love so much, my husband. I then try to conceal the terrible thought by replacing the person in my thought with someone else even though I know I would never perform such a violent act or wish it at all…my husband comforts me a lot and wants my mind to grow stronger for us but the terrible thought just keeps coming back the moment I realize I’m no longer thinking of it…I am scared to take medication because I want to have children when older
Thanks for sharing about your experience, Rosie. I’m glad the article was helpful, and completely understand about how reassurance is only temporary. It’s terrible how MOCD interferes with our closest relationships, including our sense of connection with God. I always tell people that I believe God understands the nature of our thoughts far better than we do, and knows that the mind produces MOCD thoughts against our will. And of course OCD would go after the person you love dearly. With MOCD we find that efforts to replace the thoughts or substitute something aren’t effective, because that ends up playing into OCD’s trap of treating the thoughts as if they must be avoided (which gives them more energy). I hope you find the help you need so you and your family can get some relief. I recommend looking into Jon Hershfield’s book Overcoming Harm OCD if you haven’t already. You might also consider joining the MOCD Facebook support group that I moderate: https://www.facebook.com/groups/MalevolenceOCD/. All the best to you.
Seth just wanted to say your Awesome for helping others, pure O or OCD kicks our butt sometimes/quite often. But it is nice to see someone who understands this condition, I have had Anxiety for about 26yrs now and for the last 6 yrs have been tough as it went to more of the obsessions as i guess i have always been that way but then went and seen a doctor and prescribed a SSRI Citalopram ? which i took for a couple of weeks but woke up one late night and had a bad anxiety attack which led to a crazy thought that scared the heck out of me like i thought i was going to do something bad/awful but shook it off and then went back to bed, of course i did read all the side effects of the medicine and blamed that right away and discontinued it asap but i have been obsesssive since 6yrs now reading googling everything about my condition which probably only added more fuel to the fire/OCD/Severe anxiety but I really need and want to beat these disturbing anxiety provoking thoughts so do i just try taking my Paroxetine and see a CBT therapist and see if it helps as I really need to try something because its time to get back to living and not feeling afraid most of the time and battling with myself and living inside my head. PS I do like my Beer and will admit i do need to slow down some as i know it does not help the Anxiety Thanks again Seth for any input from Joseph!
Thanks for your kind remarks, Joseph. I’m glad to hear you’re working to get help, though it can take time to find the right treatment for you. And it’s understandable to turn to alcohol at times to cut the anxiety, even if it has downsides. It’s exhausting to feel afraid most of the time! I wish you the best with the SSRI and CBT.
This makes me so much sense to me. I struggled with the whole knife thing when I was a teenager. I had to be locked up in my room or the kitchen had to be locked. Knifes had to be hidden from me, while doing the dishes, I would not even wash or dry the knifes. I had so much fear. Over time things settled, but since a little while I am having thoughts about breaking my dogs neck. It is so unsettling because as you mention in your article, I am not a violent person at all (I have never in my life done anything like that). I do not know why I am so scared to lose control… I know that I am in control of making my own decisions, but for whatever reason I sometimes do not trust myself. Thanks for this article, it makes me feel a bit more normal….
Thank you for your comments, Karen. Yes, thoughts about harming a pet are so unsettling, and not at all uncommon in MOCD. I’m glad the article was helpful. I definitely recommend Jon Hershfield’s excellent book!
Hey Doc. I really appreciate the article. I’m not sure what has been going on but I have had violent thoughts and none of which I know I will act on especially it being a loved one. I just want directions on how to minimize this. I had a really bad panic attack yesterday and haven’t been ok since. I’ll have moments but they won’t last long due to me constantly thinking im crazy. Not sure what to do.
Thanks for your comment, Charles. I’m glad you’re looking for help because MOCD can be really hard to change on one’s own. Often the things a person thinks will work, like reassuring oneself it’s OK, actually make it worse in the long run. I recommend Jon Hershfield’s excellent book, Overcoming Harm OCD, which provides detailed instructions on what treatment looks like. It’s available on Amazon and elsewhere. All the best to you.
Hello Doctor I hve something to ask you. I suffer from a moderate form of harm ocd it gets difficult at times. I have it from the last 4 years as something as on and off . Is choosing medical school as a career absurd for someone like me? I don’t know whether I could handle it or not…
I appreciate the question, Angie. I wouldn’t assume that a person with OCD can’t do any particular career. I think of people with OCD who become therapists, for example, like OCD expert Jon Hershfield. The most important thing is to set yourself up in the best way possible so that OCD isn’t a limiting factor in your life. All the best as you navigate these decisions!
Hello doctor,I am totally depressed,I have ocd i think so not sure,will tell you the details from small age onwards it started that whether something bad will happen to my parents,counting number ,counting for brushing the teeth till now and while bathing etc,for example when I am praying ,whatever I pray I used to visuvalize it in my mind ,suddenly if any bad thought comes,again from the first I will prayer,it keeps on going ,and most of the time I am getting so much angry for unwanted reason doctor,ok I am a human I too get angry,for example if my girlfriend,argue with me I too argue ,I used to control the anger but won’t let it out,but inside my heart I will be in terrible anger suddenly the swear word comes that the woman or whoever fighting with me should get raped,I feel very guilty after that doctor ,every human gets anger but they won’t think their loved one in a bad way like killing they must die,rape etc but for me it hit my mind for silly fight or the huge one,for example if my mother tells me to study ,I used to tell i won’t if she tells again in a polite and calm manner also ,suddenly I will get the anger outburst as well as these bad swear words in mind like rape,kill.for example the woman must be raped or killed ,why doctor this is happening to me I couldnt even convey my expression happiness,anger,emotion etc mainly after this I feel like dying ,I feel guilty doctor I am not doing it wantedly ,u have to help me doctor plz plz ,I am frustrated doctor
Thanks for your comments, Kiransujay. I’m sorry to hear about the torment you’ve experienced. As always, it’s a good idea to get an assessment from a qualified professional who can ask you all the right questions. That said, there are many signs in what you described that would be consistent with MOCD. The more we try not to have “unacceptable” thoughts, for example, the more we have them. It’s also common in MOCD to question whether it’s really OCD. In addition to the diagnostic assessment, I would recommend Jon Hershfield’s book, Overcoming Harm OCD. I wish you the best in your recovery.
Hi Seth
Thank you for the informative article, the information hits a very real cord with me. I have Pure O and have since I was a child. I feel that what started as offensive thoughts that would offend a perfect God made me a hideous, impure person. I believe that the OCD was wired into my brain at a very young age with DEEP feelings of guilt and shame. The mind checking from early on was intense to mentally check that the thoughts were there or not – I didn’t realize this was a compulsion.
Anyway, a few years ago I had a vivid image of a knife that my mind throw up – suspended in air and illuminated, I found this incredibly scary. This scared me so much that I was constantly checking to see if my mind would betray me and scare me again. Months on with no relief, I said consciously that I would prefer the ‘Stuck music’ which I have had on the past. This time it wont go!! My compulsions are the mentally checking, repeating words over the music and general distraction. My question is, do I need to find the SSRI that would work best for me to clear this up, or do I try ERP? Currently on Fluoxetine – but not so effective with clearing the stuck music. I strongly believe that my OCD can be managed with changing my thinking – and not necessarily taking meds. How do I change my thinking and stop (or minimize) the Pure O stuck music syndrome?
Thank you for any answer you can give me.
Kind regards,
Lisa
Hi, Lisa. You’re very welcome; I’m glad the article resonated with you. Thanks for sharing your experience. With that kind of “earworm,” we usually recommend doing the opposite of our first inclination. So instead of trying to make it go away, the person would try to make it stay! Sing it “full volume” in one’s head, try to keep it in mind, etc. Our minds tend to be rebellious, and generally what happens when we try to keep something in mind is that our minds wander to other things. All the best with this!
Hi Seth,
Thank you for a wonderful answer. I had not really thought about playing with my mind in that way. And now that I think about it, our minds are rebellious, and they DO get tired of the same-old, same-old thoughts – and in my case music. I will sing it out loud as well as in my head when the pesky earworms are there. I wont be afraid of them or try and push them away, or cover them up! But instead I will really encourage it to just be there until I become bored with it. Minds do wander – mine certainly can become distracted quite easily. I will definitely try to KEEP IT IN MIND as we both know that my mind will rebel against this and I guess, eventually let it go and release it.
Kind regards,
Lisa
My pleasure, Lisa. Most of us get these earworms at some point, and the less we wrestle with them, the more quickly we can release them. All the best to you!
Hello Doctor,
I have been finding the courage to reach out and find out what this is. I have had this since I was 18 years old, I am a extremely compulsive person, my mother loves to watch murder documentaries on investigation I.D, she can not hear that well so she either turns the volume extremely high( I have very good hearing) I can hear it with my bedroom door shut. Before I knew what this was.. I would just say mom please turn this down it is disturbing me, she never really cared. It started when I watched this show on I.d about a kid killing their family. I started to get obsessive and eventually I was thinking about it everyday at night. I never want to hurt my family. These thoughts are absolutely terrible and I just wish I could not have anxiety for a second and breathe.
I hear you, Anon. I’m glad you found this post. It’s good to seek professional help if necessary, and also to check out Overcoming Harm OCD by MOCD expert Jon Hershfield. I hope you find relief.
Hi Doctor,
Thank you for making this post. I finally gained enough courage to google what the heck I think this might be and I found your post, which has made me not as stressed. At random times I have thoughts about wanting to hurt someone in public but it always go away very fast. However, for the past few years I keep having a very vivid intrusive thoughts about hurting my parents, I believe this was brought on by being exposed to crime shows, documentaries and the station I.D at a very young age. I am 23 and I still tell my mom to not watch it around me or at least turn the volume down( she can’t hear as well) i watched this one episode where the kid murdered his family and ever since then I think that would be me. I never would want to hurt anyone , especially my loved ones. I cry all the time about it. I am about to now at work. The thoughts are so intense over and over! I use to think I was insane and thought this was all the devils work! I am so happy to know that it is common. I would like to reach out for help.. my mom would freak out completely and would send me to a hospital, my dad might understand but he’ll end up agreeing with my mom. If only I could just throw out all the knives I would feel so much better.
The things you’re describing sound consistent with MOCD, Anon, though a professional would need to make that determination in an actual evaluation. For MOCD, things like avoiding TV shows and getting rid of knives do feel better in the short run, but they just feed the cycle of obsessions and compulsions in OCD. Jon Hershfield’s book that I referenced in my last reply is a fantastic resource.
Just makes me want to hurt someone even more …. too much evil in my head .
I would certainly recommend consulting with a professional. It’s important to distinguish between actually wanting to hurt someone and fears about hurting someone when you really don’t want to.
Thank you so much for writing this. This hit home so hard I cannot stop crying. I am currently dealing with these exact thoughts and situations to the point of having several panic attacks in a day, then avoiding triggers altogether. My therapist listens to me patiently (I find comfort in also talking about these things – makes me feel less like a human monster), but hasn’t really been able to offer concrete help. Having a name for something like this (and confirming that I’m not in fact a criminal nor a psychopath) is a massive relieving factor for me.
I was wondering if having physical reactions to triggers that then trigger panic attacks, or a panic episode, are normal to MOCD?
Thank you once again!
I’m so glad you found it useful, V. Yes, the physical reactions and panic you described certainly can be a part of an extreme anxiety response in OCD. If your therapist doesn’t specialize in OCD, I would definitely recommend seeking out someone who does. He or she should be able to help you not just manage with the MOCD but find significant relief. Best wishes to you.
I came across this article after a long time of searching for what I’ve been going through and whenever I feel panicked or I have the thoughts I read it. However I do have this thought that just came on last night bc I made the mistake of watching something to do with serial killers, which wasn’t very smart. This thought makes me sick to my stomach and causes me to get anxious and its. “I want to kill.” I obviously don’t want to do this and I love my whole family so much it’s just this thought is making me think I’m a bad person. Which is why this thought is so distressing. Deep down I know I’m not. I’ve always been a family person and this all started last week when I had the thought of “what If I end up losing control of my actions and hurt someone I love?” And ever since then My mind is like a constant hampster wheel. It keeps spinning and spinning and no matter what I do it won’t stop. Also I constantly ask my parents if these thoughts makes me a bad person and they say “no, sweetie.” Which reassures me for a little bit but then it comes back a few minutes later. Every day I live in fear and panic that I’m gonna snap and end up doing something that I really don’t want to do. I have been diagnosed with GAD but after reading this article I’m wondering if maybe I have OCD as well. Because I always seem to latch onto a thought and won’t let it go. Before this I was convinced I was dying but after multiple tests were done that thought faded and now it’s this. Thank you again for this article! Even though it only reassures me for a little bit of time at least it’s a start.
I’m so glad the article was useful, Olivia. You described the condition so well — it certainly does sound like MOCD. While the reassurance feels good in the short-term, it’s actually keeping the MOCD stuck, as the article describes. I definitely recommend checking out Jon Hershfield’s book (linked in the article), and working with a therapist who really understands this form of OCD. All the best in your journey.
The fact that I’m looking for help is reassuring. The fact that I only fear the consequences and not the act is what disturbs me. A few days ago I had a knife day dream. My wife, daughter, father in law and mother in law we’re all sitting or standing around me at the dining room table. I wondered what it would be like to cut their throats. I had no anger. I just wanted to know what kind of facial expressions they would have or how fast I could do it before they reacted. Would I feel sad when it was over?
Earlier today I was in a great mood. Nothing wrong. My cat, who follows me around like a dog and is very affectionate, was trying to go outside. I picked him up by the throat and just held him there. Looking at him and squeezing just a little. Then he began to struggle and I put him down. When I put him down he wasn’t able to walk for a second. Almost as if he had “short circuited”. He’s fine now and back to following me. Completely trusting and seemingly unaffected by what I did.
These things worry me. I know they’re not normal. I have a problem. I’m a veteran and have been seen at the local VA hospital for PTSD over the years. This isn’t PTSD. This feels different.
After the incident with the cat my wife and I went out to watch a movie. After the film we came home. I felt normal. Until I saw the cat. I saw how much he still trusted me and wanted to be around me. I found that fascinating. Before the film there was a commercial for an animal shelter. The commercial choked me up. But when I saw my cat I had no emotion. Just curiosity. There’s a really bad joke there.
I honestly don’t know if I fear these thoughts or the idea of being arrested for committing murder. I just don’t know.
I don’t want to go to jail. And I’d like to think I don’t want to murder my family or my pets.
I hesitate to post this. But maybe it’s the first step to wellness. I don’t know.
I appreciate your sharing your experiences, Jack, and thank you also for your service to our country. I would recommend speaking with the clinicians at the VA about this. Ideally there is someone there who has a deep understanding of OCD, who can determine if that’s part of the picture. (By the way, I got the “really bad joke” you referenced!) I wish you the best with this.
Seth, thank you.
I cannot thank you enough.
I’ve been fighting this for ten years and until I found this article today I had believed I was a total monster.
Everything you have described here is exactly what I’ve been going through all these years down to absolute specifics. And what others (like Olivia) are sharing
I am literally bawling my eyes out as I write this, as to have a name and knowledge of this demon after all this time is a massive victory.
Thank you so much. I live in New Zealand but I’m going to find as much information as I can to help me deal with this now and I’m joining the Facebook group as we speak.
You’re very welcome, George. I’m so glad to hear it was helpful. Great to have you as part of the MOCD group, as well.
I had this about 2 1/2 years ago. I told the doctors that I wanted to go to a hospital that had ECT. I thought, if I could just shock my brain, I could think right again. So, I did go to this hospital and did ECT for weeks on end— for months. Al of a sudden, life looked beautiful, I was filled with joy, and those horrible thoughts of stabbing someone were gone. I told my doctor one day that I was afraid they would come back. He said, “No Melissa, you aren’t hearing voices anymore.” I had told them that voices were causing this, because I was so embarrassed about my situation and thoughts. So, I told him, it was never voices, but my own thoughts. He immediately told me about this violent thought disorder. He said it could be caused by severe depression, which I definitely had. So, the ECT, that I thought I was getting to make my thoughts right again, actually worked on my depression, and cured this thought pattern. Just thought you might want to look into ECT as another form of treatment. Thank you for all your information. The psychological community needs to be educated about this disorder. I saw many professionals before ending up in that hospital, and nobody mentioned this violent ocd. I actually placed a butter knife on someone’s shoulder, only as a scream and cry for help. I was arrested for menacing, but because I told them it was voices that caused it, I was taken to a hospital, instead of jail. My request for ECT saved my life. Yet, even today, when I tell psychological professions my story, they have no clue what violent ocd is, or never heard of it before. It is a very frightening and debilitating disease. Melissa T
Thanks so much for your comments, Melissa. I’m glad you found something that worked for you. Thankfully ERP tends to be really effective, so most people will not have to undergo ECT. That’s quite a path you found to healing. Hope all is well now.
Hi. I started having all these symptoms lately. Too much fear because of the ‘what ifs’. I even reached the point where I got familiarized with my fears and started thinking if I was really going to do something bad. I doubted my self. At some point I just thought ok, that’s it, I am going to kill somebody, who knows, I might be crazy after all or a murderer, it might feel ok. I thought that for a moment actually. Do you think that somebody could reach at that point because they can’t handle it anymore? Is it a complication after so many what ifs? I don’t think I could hurt somebody, and after all I don’t have any reasons why. But what if I could? And then, some of the what if thoughts I used to have where accompanied by anger, for example I was mad to my friend and I started thinking I would hurt her only to get scared of my thoughts. But what if I could actually do something bad after all, even if I had no reason, just because I am crazy or bad and I don’t know it? And what if it feels ok. I mean, it scares me now, but under circumstances could I do it? And, most importantly, why did I think I could do it, even for a moment? Do you think ocd could finally open a path to craziness? Because no normal people would do that. And I don’t recognise my self into all this, what if this thought was my snap? I am going to see a psychiatrist tomorrow and for as long as I keep being logic, I would prefer to be hospitalized or arrested in advance in order to avoid harming somebody. I would appreciate to hear your thoughts. And thanks for the article, it helped up to a certain point.
Thanks for your comment. I’m glad to know the article was somewhat helpful, and that you’re seeing a professional. Hopefully they’re familiar with this condition. I can’t offer a diagnosis, of course, but basically everything you said are common fears among those with MOCD. I hope the doctor is helpful. Also consider getting Jon Hershfield’s book, linked in the article. All the best to you.
Thanks for the reply doctor ,u have mentioned that I might have mocd actually can u explain the full form and tell me the symptoms,I checked in Google but I didn’t get
Hi, Kiransujay. I would recommend referring to the article, where I explain it. Also keep in mind that if it is MOCD, there will likely be a tendency to repeatedly check if it’s really OCD. Thanks for your question.
Seth,
I just read your article, “Am I A Monster” and it fits me completely. I have always been afraid to speak out about it. I have had it through childhood which was more just managing severe anger toward people. When I was a Marine this gave it some gruesome tools and logistics. I have thought of it as some dark presence that I had to battle. The worst time of the day is usually 4AM to 8AM. It has caused me to drink to try to get away from it. I know that usually doesn’t work but I am a social drinker and then it helps me sleep through the night without thinking to myself.
It usually comes around in the end of a relationship of someone I care about. I usually sabotage my relationships purposely so the love feeling never gets there. Well I just did it again and I am in the virtuous cycles again. I usually think of her boyfriends that she is or isn’t with. This has been the source of so much damage in my life and some of the people I have cared about most.
You should also note that this is the first time I have ever looked at getting help. I went last week to the VA and unloaded except this part.
What do I do now?
Thanks so much for your comments and question, TJ. I recommend seeking a professional trained in ERP for OCD, who’s familiar with MOCD. You could inquire at the VA, or use the Search function on iocdf.org. Jon Hershfield’s book, Overcoming Harm OCD, is also an excellent resource. Jon’s going to be on my podcast next month, coincidentally. All the best to you, TJ, as you move through this.
I have constant thoughts of death and hurting people, but not only just imagining walking up to someone and stabbing them but I have thoughts of being a powerfull DICTATOR, im serious, im always thinking I don’t just want to be a serial killer and kill one or 10 people, I would love to be a dictator and torture and jail millions of people as im a misanthrope, I always say hitler was a wimp because he never visited any of the camps himself, if I was a dictator I would be more than happy to watch people suffer and beg and kiss my feet to stop my soldiors from killing them all, which the more they beg and cry I would be more vicious towards them, I drive a cab for a living 80hours a week I hate it so much but im so stuck in my ways I cant find a better job and im too depressed and lazy to find a new job so I just stew in my hatred of my job and lack of sleep and no social life at all.
If I get cut off on the road or someone is following me too closely or road rages me I just think to myself, when I get into power I will make the 3rd reich seem like a left wing party compared to what I will do to humanity, since truckies and tradesmens vans are the worst on the road, if I get into power I will order my hit squad to find and arrest all truck driver and tradespeople and put them in a special camp where they will be brutally tortured all day, and I will personally visit to what these scum of the earth in pain, just to get back at them for all the pain they put me through by their road rage on me.
So yeah, and the thing that’s stopping me from being a serial killer is im actually a skinny wimp so someone like me would get beaten to death in jail very quickly so that’s why I hold back from hurting people, not because of my conscience because humans to me are just walking talking pieces of meat, people are 70% water and the rest just protein, that’s all humans are to be water and flesh that can walk and talk, but If I knew I would get away with it 100% and never go to jail I would start hurting people tomorrow if I wanted to, the next scum that cuts me off on the road I would force his car into an oncoming truck and watch the truck smash into him, and I would be the happiest person in the world, I would have 0 regrets, I would sleep like a baby knowing I have done a great thing taking out a scum bag driver from the road, even though he might be a good family man with a wife and kids, not my problem, behind the wheel he was pure scum so he deserved to die.
everything I write here is 100% true from my heart im not a troll, its all what I think about all day.
Pete, I approved your comment because it so clearly illustrates the difference between MOCD and what you’re describing—-a heartfelt desire to harm others. I hope something changes for the better in your life before you wind up hurting someone.
Does mocd makes us angry often ,and makes us frustrated with anger swear words and harmfull thoughts in mind.if I get anger suddenly an harmful thought will come with that anger,am I a bad person doctor ,does mocd makes us like that or am Is bad person
MOCD can certainly make a person think they’re bad. I can’t speak specifically to your situation, Kiransujay. I would discuss it with a professional, and consider reading Jon Hershfield’s excellent book, OVERCOMING HARM OCD.
Sir but can u plz check it and conform regarding the issue I am depressed
Please help me. I’m 30 years old and have been dealing with intrusive thoughts for about a year now, I usually don’t struggle much with them as I’m able to shrug it off and know that it’s ridiculous and I would never do it consciously. But then my smart brain goes “well what if I do it unconsciously” like sleep waking! And of course google all the stories about homicidal sleep walkers and freak out. I briefly remember sleepwalking a few times as a child and once in my early 20s after a night of heavily drinking, peed in a dresser drawer (embarrasing) however I am known for sleep talking quite frequently… I havent been able to kick this recent intrusive thought of sleepwalking into my kitchen, grabbing a knife and stabbing my family and waking up with my whole life and everyone I love gone forever. It’s crippling. To the point where I can’t sleep, I wrap myself in blankets like a taco so “I can’t get up” dread about sleeping all day long. And then to make it worse I read “you dream and sleep walk things that you think about before bed or during the day” and then talk myself into believing that I’ll sleep walk BECAUSE I keep thinking about sleep waking… it’s honestly the worst case of ocd I’ve had and few months ago I was sure I had brain cancer…
I’ve thought about hiding the knives or asking my spouse to sleep in another room with the door locked but I know that feeds into the fear rather than concurring it. I recently went out and bought an Apple Watch so I can monitor my sleep patterns, which all prove I don’t sleep walk but it just won’t go away. I am absolutely petrified that one morning I’m going to wake up with my whole life crushed. Is acting out an intrusive thought in your sleep possible? Will I EVER get over this? Do people with low history of sleep walkers become sleep walkers?
Thanks for sharing your experience, Heather. OCD can be so painful. I can tell you that the odds of acting on the fears you have, given what you’ve described, is vanishingly small. That said, OCD thrives on uncertainty, so the fact that I can’t say there’s ZERO chance is hard for OCD to swallow. What I can tell you is that efforts to know for sure that a person in your situation would never do the things you’re afraid of, plays into the hands of OCD, whereas practicing living with a reasonable degree of uncertainty is the path toward freedom. I recommend Jon Hershfield’s book on the topic, and certainly ERP if it’s available to you. Sending you my best.
Thank you so much for the article. It really helped me. I’ve been going through it since forever, whether it be my mum or fiancé, my partner’s mum and so on, since I was little I’d always be like “well I could just punch her right in the face” etc but never bothered me, I believe it’s because I did not react or doubt that I would do it. Now that I’m older, and having gone through a few years of undescribable health anxiety due to teenage drug abuse.. it’s come back but it’s fears that I’ll stab my fiance in my sleep and not be in control. I would never do such a thing, she is aware of my thoughts and has comforted me about them which in turn has made me worse reassuring. I’ve even cried on her pleading with her I would never harm her. It’s going to be a slow process but I’m ready to accept that I need professional help to get through this issue.
Thanks
My pleasure, Michael—-I’m so glad to hear that the article was helpful. All the best to you as you seek professional help and on your journey to healing.
As many therapists and psychologists I have had the pleasure of working with, none of them confirmed my suspicions of either being OCD or simply having OCD tendencies. Since I was 10 years old, I fought with myself on how ugly of a person I must be for battling homicidal thoughts. I spent nights laying in my bed, getting out of the bed, putting a knife in my hand and setting it back down to get the feeling and thought out of my head. I also obsessed over whether my feet would turn callused, and used nail clippers to clip at harder parts of my skin. I feel like this insight you’ve given has been a MAJOR eye-opener. Whether it is OCD or OCD tendencies, I thought for sure I battled with it. I have been professionally diagnosed with GAD+ panic attacks and recurrent Major Depressive Disorder. I’m sure, now, that I can relate this back to the earlier stages of my anxieties. Thank you so much for your insight! Honestly, you have been the most helpful out of a majority of my therapists.
Thank you so much for letting me know, Nicole. Knowing what you’re dealing with makes all the difference, doesn’t it? All the best to you as you continue this work!
I am strange tbh. I sort of like my ability to put my mind in any perspective, even if it is of something I have no desire to be. The only worry I do have is that, one day, something might brake out of the container I have made to contain these thoughts. This desire, though, probably does not help keep my inner mental state calm. I sort of want to share this stuff with the world as I think that anything can be put to good use. Ignoring point of views and pretending they don’t exist or that it is “beyond reasoning” only makes them unpredictable. The other thing I worry about though is that sharing were my knowledge of such things comes from will cause people to become wary of me to the point of completely avoiding me. tbh it’s kind of comforting knowing that the people around you are at least “on guard” to stuff but to be completely avoided is what I fear. Because it is when I am completely avoided that my knowledge will be rendered completely useless. idk :/
Thanks for your thoughts, aperson. To be honest I’m not entirely sure what to make of your experience. If you’re finding it distressing, you might consider talking with a doctor or other professional.
Thank you so much for this article .. I’m 14 and have been having a very hard time with my anxiety lately. I’ve been feeling very guilty over things I’ve done in the past and with that guilt came these horrifying, gut wrenching thoughts about committing sexual acts on my younger siblings,my mom and sometimes even harming them.When I was younger I was exposed to some things that later on led me to have some sort of trauma so whenever that sort of topic (sex) comes around I get this unsettling feeling in my stomach..which I guess is some type of PTSD I get. I do not know where these thoughts came from but I am guessing they were triggered my anxiety that just seems to get worse. I had been going to counseling but i refused to tell my “therapist” about my haunting thoughts out of fear that she might think I was a threat to my family and would actually act on these thoughts or that I was just losing my mind.My mom noticed that things didnt seem to get better and that going to the counselings would just set me back so she decided that I shouldn’t go counseling anymore which makes getting help much harder for me since I have no professional to reach out to..I kept on searching similar topics trying to find a way to explain all of this to my mom without sounding like an upcoming serial killer or some sort of child molester which brought me to your article…these thoughts just keep on haunting me no matter what I do and it’s truly draining having to deal with the guilt and anxiety that comes with those thoughts… I get anxiety everytime I am around my siblings because I fear that I’ll snap and harm them..so now I just try to avoid them and movies or videos having to do with serial killers or child molesters because hearing of their troubled childhoods(knowing mine) scares me into believing that I’ll become that sooner or later…I have these thoughts on a daily basis and I keep on getting more and more…I only hope that I’m able to get the help I need and hopefully close this horrifying chapter in my life
I’m so glad to hear that the article was helpful to you. I definitely recommend reading Jon Hershfield’s book *Overcoming Harm OCD*. You might share it with your parents, too. For an OCD-informed therapist, try http://www.iocdf.org. All the best to you.
Thank you so much for this article.. Lately I’ve been thinking horrible but excited thoughts of hurting someone, usually I feel a really hot tingly feeling in my chest and I can’t stop laughing. These random thoughts have been directed at many of my enemies, as well as a girl at my middle school who is in a relationship with my crush. I really think this can help me.
I’m so glad you found it useful, Olivia. I recommend talking with a professional. People with MOCD usually say they feel horrified, not excited, by the thoughts of hurting someone. It’s important to know what’s driving the thoughts. I wish you the best.
Hello, thanks for the article. My form of OCD is trying to undo various unpleasant thoughts by mental and practical rituals. Socially, I’m prone to keep the stress and anger inside when they’re aroused. I’ve found some release in directing the harmful thoughts, not in “what if” way but in an affirmative way “I’m gonna…” “I must…” etc., towards the people that cause the stress, UNLESS they’re the people I’m trying to care deeply about (family and friends). Then that release becomes my enemy. Then I find myself thinking of harming family members and, most horrible of all, how easy it might appear to be. I try to balk away and negate but of course the OCD takes over and keeps pounding me back with the same thoughts I readily applied for people I don’t like. My will hangs in there but I can’t help but think what if those thoughts are really me and if it wouldn’t bring a release if I heed to them. Could OCD be masking SCH in my case?
Thank you for commenting, worried boy. There are so many “what ifs,” aren’t there? I recommend consulting with a professional if at all possible—-check out iocdf.org–and also Jon Hershfield’s excellent book, Overcoming Harm OCD. Wishing you all the best.
Excellent article, similar to exposure therapy I received, which helped. Though I take slight issue with the idea that “reassurance” is always unhelpful, since folks with OCD, ironically, might latch on to *that* very claim as an all or nothing idea! In my view, there’s a difference between reassurance out of fear and avoidance (I’m not going to, I’m not going to, etc), and for example, a CONVICTION learned from treatment that “I’ve been through this before, and I KNOW I’m not what my asinine thought says I am, and so I can accept myself and move on.” Call it healthy reassurance, perhaps, but it works for me and has helped me move on in life. Thanks.
It’s a terrific point, Ron, to distinguish between the uncertainty of reassurance seeking, and the conviction of knowing who you are and what OCD is. Maybe we could call that “assurance,” vs. re-assurance. I think of it as the bedrock that we often get to in treatment, when the obsessions become easier to dismiss because I just know they’re not me. Thanks for your comments!
Thanks for the quick reply as well as for the recommendation, Seth, it’s an excellent book!
Cheers
Is it normal for a person with Harm OCD to get used to these thoughts? Before I used to freak out a lot but now i don’t freak out as much.
Great Q, Gochi. Yes, that is extremely common in MOCD. For many people that becomes its own source of fear–If I’m not as bothered by these thoughts, does that mean I’m more likely to act on them? OCD is tricky and tries to stick around any way possible. In ERP for OCD, we treat that fear just like other obsessions, with exposure and ritual prevention. Best wishes to you.
Thank you so much for writing this article. It came out of the blue really, my boyfriend just left for work and I was sitting on my phone and decided to look up fears and stuff to figure out what was up with me bc I have issues one of which is MOCD and literally this was so very helpful and I’m so very grateful for you. I never knew that these thoughts and fears and stuff were an actual condition and I felt so alone and so like a monster because of them but then your article literally showed me that I wasn’t alone and that other people struggle with the same issues I do and that there is hope to overcoming MOCD. That makes me so happy! I support you fully in your mission in trying to help people on here and once again thank you so much for writing this and providing the Facebook support group. I found hope and answers to something I didn’t even know I was looking for hope and answers for, thanks to you. Have a wonderful day.
My pleasure, Alabama Girl, and I’m so glad to hear it was helpful. There is plenty of reason to be hopeful. Warm regards to you.
I read this to see if i have MOCD. I do. And aren’t i terrified. Literally i be holding an object that can harm someone and then i would have a image that is bloody scary and has tons of gore (not going into detail because i dont wanna freak people out). And i’m only 13 and i have these horrifying thoughts and images in my head!
I hope you find help for this condition, Space boy, and that you can talk with a parent or other trusted adult about your experiences. Help is available. Thanks for your comments.
Thank you for writing this. It answered a lot for me. I will try to get help asap. Also, it has made me very upset – why my Psychiatrist was not able to see this after hearing these symptoms for 3 years now? It makes me angry that my miserable non-stop crying today forced me to do a google search. I have a question – I might have had 10% of this problem before I had my child, today she is 5 years old and I suffer from these horrifying thoughts everyday. Daily, for 5 years. Only I know what my daily routine is like with her, fear and anxiety every sec. Such a shame it is that Drs overlooked this, I have been vocal about this for 5 years.
My pleasure, Urm. I’m sorry it’s been such a long road, even with being in treatment. Unfortunately even professionals who treat OCD often don’t understand what it is. And it’s very common for the symptoms to get worse with the arrival of a child. Being a parent makes having these thoughts all the more upsetting. I hope you find relief soon.
Dear Seth,
Two years ago, I made a comment on this page, and today, I came across it again as an OCD free individual.
Rereading the comment, and this article, reminded me how far I’ve come on my journey, which I can mainly accredit to you.
Two years ago I was severely depressed, riddled with anxiety, and was constantly plagued with intrusive thoughts.
This article was my main source of comfort, and the only thing that could calm me down after a panic attack.
I read it almost religiously, like clockwork, every day after school, at exactly 4:30PM.
I read it so often I could quote entire paragraphs off the top of my head, and often did so on late nights when I couldn’t sleep due to the buzz of intrusive thoughts thundering around in my skull.
Your work, and your response to my comment those years ago, really helped pull me out of one of the darkest times of my entire life, and I owe everything I have, everything I am, to you.
I am truly grateful for what you’ve done for me, and for so many others, so I decided to reach out to you today and leave this comment thanking you for your assistance in helping me overcome this mental illness
If it weren’t for your work, I wholeheartedly believe I would still be stuck in the dark pit that is OCD, so I cannot thank you enough.
Yours truly,
Sajj
Dear Sajj,
I remember your original comment from a couple years ago, and I was deeply touched by this message. I’m so happy to hear that you’re doing so well, and appreciate knowing that my article had something to do with that. Thank you for your generous words. The best I can hope for in my work is that it might help to change someone’s life for the better. I am truly grateful to know that you’re no longer in that pit of OCD and depression.
My warmest regards,
Seth
How do I reply to someone’s comment? When I hit REPLY nothing happens
I’m not sure why that’s happening, K. I think if you scroll down to the bottom of the comments you can leave your reply there. I’ll look into why it’s not opening up a comment under the comment you’re replying to….
Dr. Gillihan,
I am deeply grateful for such an informative and thorough article. It iso resonating and helpfully speaking to my struggles, which are almost identical to many things you describe here. Around 6 years ago I had my first panic attack and around the same time I started dealing with severe intrusive thoughts. I previously had problems with feeling immense despair and anxiety but never to this degree. My mind suddenly got attacked by harm-related intrusive thoughts that lasted for some months. I kept fearing that I may actually lose control and act based on them. I went into depths of despair trying to decipher where is the source of those thoughts. I would sit with fear for hours, trying to hold my shoulders tightly and not move in order to avoid the possibility of harmful actions out of my control, and reflect on myself and see what basis I can find inside me that gives me the reassurance that I will choose to do that which is good and not act based on horrific thoughts that come to: What is the guarantee that I will choose the right thing? What if I lose a sense of what is good and what is bad? Am I really in control of myself? How can I prove that? what if I ruin my whole life out of my own control?
At the time I sought some therapy sessions that were relatively helpful, but not fully addressing my problem in an effective way. I found some information online. Your awesome article was not out yet, but on some other experts’ pages I found helpful writings and videos, and little by little, without much planning or control on my side, the crisis subsided. Since then, these thoughts some times return to me. Mainly certain objects or situations can trigger them. But luckily they have not stayed for too long. I think whenever I deal with despair and hopelessness or miserable situations in life I become more prone to them. The experience I had back then was so painful that the horror of it coming back with that intensity fills me with such sadness.
I am also worried about my mental health when I think of my family history. My mother had a very severe cleanness OCD since I was born until now, and among other family members and relatives there have been extreme cases of depression and OCD. So I keep wondering if I need to seek treatment and what kind of therapy would be the best option for me. This article now felt so truthful that I thought I may ask your advice about what is the best way to go. Even though I am not experiencing these thoughts as overwhelmingly as before, should I still seek therapy? Or should I just let them come and go, and only take action if they get really severe again? I appreciate your input a lot!
I really appreciate your sharing your story here. It’s a great Q about seeking therapy. I wouldn’t think of it so much in terms of “should” or “shouldn’t,” but more about whether it might be useful to talk to a specialist about your experience. Even if the intrusive thoughts don’t recur, it sounds like they’ve left quite a lasting impression on you, and it could be helpful to discuss that with someone who really understands MOCD (i.e., not someone who’s going to try to make you find the “root cause” of the thoughts or something). Wishing you all the best.
Thank you so much for this great informative article. I thought I’m the only one having these kind of bad thoughts. I’ve struggling for long time having this kind of thought until now. Your article really explained well my situation.
My pleasure, Danish. So glad you found it helpful.
Thank you so much for this article Dr. I feel so relief reading a lot of the comments and realize there is hope, this thing is not forever. Sadly I’m currently at the point you describe “What’s worse, constantly thinking about these fears can make them seem less upsetting simply from the repetition. Then a person with MOCD might be horrified that he’s not as horrified by the thoughts as he used to be, and may mistakenly believe that he’s warming up to the idea of acting on them.” I’m currently on therapy and I know it’s not a simple thing, it’s a process, maybe the quarantine the world it’s currently living it’s not in the favour of anybody and I feel so desperate but I will never lose hope and special know that I found this place, again thank you so much.
I’m so glad you found the article helpful, Edgar. Wishing you the best with your treatment. Hold on to that hope! Few things are more important….
Ever since I was 14 I’ve been stuggling with these thoughts (I’m 25 now) I have severe depression, panic disorder, GAD, and BPD. I feel like a monster for having these thoughts but I can’t seem to get them to go away. It gets to the point where I’ll see an image in my head and then it feels like I’m going to act it out which terrifys me because I don’t want to, but it’s almost as if someone is making me do it? I constantly have to reassure myself and tell myself that I don’t want to hurt others and I’m not a bad person but that only lasts for a minute and then the horrible thoughts overpower my head and my anxiety sky rockets. I’m seeing a therapist and psychiatrist but it seems like these thoughts will never go away. Good luck to everybody and hang in there.
Hang in there, Jessica. I hope you’re getting exposure and response prevention therapy. Search at iocdf.org if you need an ERP therapist. All best to you.
So its normal for me to think about hurting people most of the day ? I’m such a kind hearted person I don’t know why these thoughts started happening it all started 3 days ago and hasn’t stopped read your article its good feeling to know im not alone in this battle some time it gets overwhelming but im still fighting it . I just would like reinsurance that I wont just black out or snao and come to alot of people hurt
What you’re describing is not at all uncommon, and sounds consistent with MOCD. I recommend consulting a professional for an evaluation. You can search for one at iocdf.org. Wishing you all the best.
Hello from Germany.
I think I’m suffering from this MOCD.
It all started with a few Panic Attacks out of the blue, after i learned of the Suicide attempt of a Friend, two months ago.
Which (i belive) was the final piece to make me break down, after years of work and life related stress.
First it was just Harm OCD, but then it switched to MOCD like thoughts… directed towards the only family i have. Which is pure HELL.
I havent found a trigger for it yet. These thoughts come out of the blue at random…
Sometimes they dissapear for hours or even days (longest period without any was 5)… i feel completely different (normal and good) without these thoughts…
So far i dont take any Medication, a SSRI was offered but i didnt want to.
I hope i can overcome this.. HELL in my mind.
I hope you can overcome this too. I’m sorry it’s so miserable. Hopefully you can find a therapist who specializes in exposure and response prevention, a type of cognitive behavioral therapy for OCD–even one who offers teletherapy if there’s no one in your local area. I also recommend Jon Hershfield’s excellent book on Harm OCD. I’m sending you all best wishes.
Thanks so much for this it’s helped me in my search to understand my adult child with OCD. They fear becoming “totally depraved” or “hedonistic” so slightly to the side of MOCD but obviously closely related in terms of fear of losing control. They have started on meds and we are seeking CBT/ERP but your article is so helpful in picking apart the mechanisms and engaging the thinking part of the brain as opposed to (or as well as) the fight/flight part of the brain. It’s a brilliant example of psycho education that is helping me and my loved one to manage this thing.
I’m so glad to hear it was helpful, Jules. I’m wishing you and your family all the best as you pursue effective treatment.
Hey, I am a young teen and I don’t have any disorder. But I’ve struggled my entire life with the things you were describing and at some points, it’s been a waking nightmare. Thank you so much for publishing this article. It’s encouraging me to reach out for some help even though it’s one of the scariest things I’ve had to do.
You’re very welcome. I definitely encourage you to follow that impulse to reach out for help, probably starting with a trusted adult. If you don’t have a specialist near you, you can probably find one who offers therapy through video calls. The website IOCDF.org is a good place to look. Wishing you all the best.
Hello there,
Thank you so very much for this – it is really helpful. I’ve had this since I was a young child (on and off) but it has been particularly bad since having my daughter (now 2). I have intrusive thoughts re harming her (in every way) and it’s so very distressing. I also often question my actions, thinking that I have hurt her or handled her too roughly when I know rationally that I have not. I wondered if this is common? It almost feels delusional in terms of my past actions. It is so hard and so isolating.
Thank you for making me feel less alone.
Thank you for sharing your experiences, Anon. It’s heartbreaking, isn’t it? Yes, what you’re describing is very common in OCD–the difficulty trusting one’s own memory and worrying they did something terrible. I have worked with many people who had this experience and it can be especially challenging for them because there’s no way to go back and make sure they didn’t so some horrific act. It’s understandable in the context of OCD, though, the so-called “doubting disease.” You’re not alone, my friend. And there is help available. I hope you can find a therapist or other resources to guide you through this. I suspect you are an excellent Mum.
Thanks so much for this, it is so helpful! I have been having fears that I will harm someone and it’s the last thing I would ever want to do, it makes me feel panicked and sick. I’m in therapy now for anxiety and have mentioned that I’m worried I have OCD (my dad has OCD, so I’m familiar with some of the other symptoms, and know there might be a genetic component). My therapist kind of treated my fears as if they were temptation and I found it very disheartening. I’ve looked on the iocdf.org website and think there may be OCD specialists in my area. Should I try to switch to one of them?
Hi, Anon. I’m so glad it was helpful. It is probably a very good idea to at least schedule a consultation with an OCD specialist. Finding the right treatment can make all the difference, and not every therapist has a good understanding of OCD, including harm-related OCD. Best wishes finding the help you need!
I am really Thankful to you for this article. I am going through the whole thing of thinking I am a bad person since last 5 years. and sometimes watching or reading the terms that trigger me. gives me the entire feeling you have described. I am terrified. mostly because for me, it is harming a child. cause the news and the media of it are horrible. it makes me sick. and it goes round and round in my head. till I feel broken and seek solace in death. And I Pray to god to remove this from my head. but thank you for the small guidance.
I’m so glad to hear it was helpful, Hunny. Having intrusive thoughts about the last thing in the world we would want to do, or be capable of doing, is so punishing. I hope you can get the treatment that can provide some freedom.
I’m such an asshole. I’m so angry that I hurt people that are good to me.
I’m sorry to hear that, Jeff. We all hurt the ones we love at times, and it’s usually those who are closest to us that see our worst. I want to be clear for other readers that this sounds like a different issue from MOCD, but it might also benefit from talking with a clinician about it. Sending best wishes to you.
I went looking for something that would help with my adverse reaction to a therapy modality that didn’t work for someone. I don’t want to risk my decisions making someone’s condition worse. So how do I embark in a healing practice when I’m worried I might make people worse if I mess up?
These are important questions Jenny. I can’t say specifically without knowing more, but I can say that it sounds like it could be very helpful to discuss these concerns with someone so you can move forward in a way that is constructive. I’m sending you all best wishes.
My dad has a mental illness and it will make him be mean to you and he won’t realize he is and then he’ll decide to swear at you he’ll say the nonsense to you stop sending me pictures I very much would like him to be cured of his mental illness. He will decide he wants to swear at you on Google messages.
Sorry to hear it, Jeremy. I hope your dad gets the help he needs.
Having murderous thought is not the same as having muderous intent
Yes, that’s an important point, Bob. Thank you.